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Captioning funded by CBS
and FORD--
BUILT FOR THE ROAD AHEAD.
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>> Logan: ON THE TENTH
ANNIVERSARY OF THE ATTACKS ON
9/11, WE BRING YOU THE STORY OF
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ANNIVERSARY OF THE ATTACKS ON
9/11, WE BRING YOU THE STORY OF
THE FBI AGENT WHO HELPED TO
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9/11, WE BRING YOU THE STORY OF
THE FBI AGENT WHO HELPED TO
CRACK THE CASE AGAINST AL QAEDA.
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THE FBI AGENT WHO HELPED TO
CRACK THE CASE AGAINST AL QAEDA.
>> THE MOST IMPORTANT
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CRACK THE CASE AGAINST AL QAEDA.
>> THE MOST IMPORTANT
INFORMATION IS IDENTIFYING
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>> THE MOST IMPORTANT
INFORMATION IS IDENTIFYING
KHALID SHEIK MOHAMMED AS THE
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INFORMATION IS IDENTIFYING
KHALID SHEIK MOHAMMED AS THE
MASTERMIND OF 9/11.
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KHALID SHEIK MOHAMMED AS THE
MASTERMIND OF 9/11.
>> Logan: ALI SOUFAN HAS NEVER
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MASTERMIND OF 9/11.
>> Logan: ALI SOUFAN HAS NEVER
SHOWN HIS FACE ON TV, BUT
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>> Logan: ALI SOUFAN HAS NEVER
SHOWN HIS FACE ON TV, BUT
TONIGHT, HE TELLS "60 MINUTES"
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SHOWN HIS FACE ON TV, BUT
TONIGHT, HE TELLS "60 MINUTES"
ABOUT INTERROGATING AND
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TONIGHT, HE TELLS "60 MINUTES"
ABOUT INTERROGATING AND
OUTWITTING SOME OF BIN LADEN'S
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ABOUT INTERROGATING AND
OUTWITTING SOME OF BIN LADEN'S
LIEUTENANTS.
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OUTWITTING SOME OF BIN LADEN'S
LIEUTENANTS.
>> AND I SAID, "WELL, I KNOW
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LIEUTENANTS.
>> AND I SAID, "WELL, I KNOW
THAT AL QAEDA DID THAT.
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>> AND I SAID, "WELL, I KNOW
THAT AL QAEDA DID THAT.
SOMEONE TOLD ME."
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THAT AL QAEDA DID THAT.
SOMEONE TOLD ME."
HE SAID, "WHO TOLD YOU?"
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SOMEONE TOLD ME."
HE SAID, "WHO TOLD YOU?"
I SAID, "YOU DID."
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HE SAID, "WHO TOLD YOU?"
I SAID, "YOU DID."
HE TOTALLY COLLAPSED.
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I SAID, "YOU DID."
HE TOTALLY COLLAPSED.
>> Logan: HE COLLAPSED?
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HE TOTALLY COLLAPSED.
>> Logan: HE COLLAPSED?
>> HE PUT HIS HANDS LIKE THIS ON
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>> Logan: HE COLLAPSED?
>> HE PUT HIS HANDS LIKE THIS ON
HIS FACE AND WENT DOWN.
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>> HE PUT HIS HANDS LIKE THIS ON
HIS FACE AND WENT DOWN.
AND HE STARTS SHAKING.
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HIS FACE AND WENT DOWN.
AND HE STARTS SHAKING.
HE KNEW WHAT HE DID.
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AND HE STARTS SHAKING.
HE KNEW WHAT HE DID.
>> Logan: HE KNEW THAT HE...
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HE KNEW WHAT HE DID.
>> Logan: HE KNEW THAT HE...
>> HE JUST GAVE UP BIN LADEN, HE
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>> Logan: HE KNEW THAT HE...
>> HE JUST GAVE UP BIN LADEN, HE
JUST GAVE UP AL QAEDA ON 9/11.
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>> HE COMES IN, HIS HANDS ARE
CUPPED.
AND HE'S GOT BONES IN HIS HANDS.
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CUPPED.
AND HE'S GOT BONES IN HIS HANDS.
AND HE GOES UP TO THE MEDICAL
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AND HE'S GOT BONES IN HIS HANDS.
AND HE GOES UP TO THE MEDICAL
EXAMINER AND HE PUTS THE BONES
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AND HE GOES UP TO THE MEDICAL
EXAMINER AND HE PUTS THE BONES
IN FRONT OF HIM AND HE GOES,
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EXAMINER AND HE PUTS THE BONES
IN FRONT OF HIM AND HE GOES,
"THIS IS MY SON."
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IN FRONT OF HIM AND HE GOES,
"THIS IS MY SON."
>> Pelley: IT WAS AFTER HEARING
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"THIS IS MY SON."
>> Pelley: IT WAS AFTER HEARING
STORY AFTER STORY LIKE THIS THAT
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>> Pelley: IT WAS AFTER HEARING
STORY AFTER STORY LIKE THIS THAT
DR. BENJAMIN LUFT DECIDED TO
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STORY AFTER STORY LIKE THIS THAT
DR. BENJAMIN LUFT DECIDED TO
COMPILE THE WORLD TRADE CENTER
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DR. BENJAMIN LUFT DECIDED TO
COMPILE THE WORLD TRADE CENTER
ORAL HISTORY PROJECT-- UNEDITED,
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COMPILE THE WORLD TRADE CENTER
ORAL HISTORY PROJECT-- UNEDITED,
UNVARNISHED REALITY AS
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ORAL HISTORY PROJECT-- UNEDITED,
UNVARNISHED REALITY AS
EXPERIENCED BY THE RESPONDERS TO
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UNVARNISHED REALITY AS
EXPERIENCED BY THE RESPONDERS TO
GROUND ZERO.
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EXPERIENCED BY THE RESPONDERS TO
GROUND ZERO.
>> IT WAS CRAZY.
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GROUND ZERO.
>> IT WAS CRAZY.
>> IT WAS ALMOST LIKE TAKING A
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>> IT WAS CRAZY.
>> IT WAS ALMOST LIKE TAKING A
CIVICS CLASS AS TO WHAT IS
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>> IT WAS ALMOST LIKE TAKING A
CIVICS CLASS AS TO WHAT IS
IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A CITIZEN.
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CIVICS CLASS AS TO WHAT IS
IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A CITIZEN.
WHAT IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
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IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A CITIZEN.
WHAT IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
HUMAN BEING.
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WHAT IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
HUMAN BEING.
WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO BEING AN
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HUMAN BEING.
WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO BEING AN
AMERICAN.
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>> I'M STEVE KROFT.
>> I'M LESLEY STAHL.
>> I'M BOB SIMON.
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>> I'M LESLEY STAHL.
>> I'M BOB SIMON.
>> I'M MORLEY SAFER.
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>> I'M BOB SIMON.
>> I'M MORLEY SAFER.
>> I'M LARA LOGAN.
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>> I'M MORLEY SAFER.
>> I'M LARA LOGAN.
>> I'M SCOTT PELLEY.
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>> I'M LARA LOGAN.
>> I'M SCOTT PELLEY.
THOSE STORIES TONIGHT ON THIS
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>> I'M SCOTT PELLEY.
THOSE STORIES TONIGHT ON THIS
SPECIAL 9/11 EDITION OF "60
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THOSE STORIES TONIGHT ON THIS
SPECIAL 9/11 EDITION OF "60
MINUTES."
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>> Logan: TONIGHT, ON THE TENTH
ANNIVERSARY OF 9/11, WE BRING
YOU THE STORY OF SOMEONE WHO HAS
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ANNIVERSARY OF 9/11, WE BRING
YOU THE STORY OF SOMEONE WHO HAS
NEVER SHOWN HIS FACE ON
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YOU THE STORY OF SOMEONE WHO HAS
NEVER SHOWN HIS FACE ON
TELEVISION BEFORE, AND FOR GOOD
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NEVER SHOWN HIS FACE ON
TELEVISION BEFORE, AND FOR GOOD
REASON.
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TELEVISION BEFORE, AND FOR GOOD
REASON.
ALI SOUFAN WAS ONE OF THE FBI'S
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REASON.
ALI SOUFAN WAS ONE OF THE FBI'S
SECRET WEAPONS IN ITS FIGHT
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ALI SOUFAN WAS ONE OF THE FBI'S
SECRET WEAPONS IN ITS FIGHT
AGAINST AL QAEDA.
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SECRET WEAPONS IN ITS FIGHT
AGAINST AL QAEDA.
A LEBANESE-AMERICAN, FLUENT IN
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AGAINST AL QAEDA.
A LEBANESE-AMERICAN, FLUENT IN
ARABIC, HE INTERROGATED AL QAEDA
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A LEBANESE-AMERICAN, FLUENT IN
ARABIC, HE INTERROGATED AL QAEDA
PRISONERS AT SECRET LOCATIONS
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ARABIC, HE INTERROGATED AL QAEDA
PRISONERS AT SECRET LOCATIONS
ALL OVER THE WORLD.
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PRISONERS AT SECRET LOCATIONS
ALL OVER THE WORLD.
SOUFAN WAS KNOWN FOR HIS ABILITY
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ALL OVER THE WORLD.
SOUFAN WAS KNOWN FOR HIS ABILITY
TO OUTWIT TERRORISTS.
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SOUFAN WAS KNOWN FOR HIS ABILITY
TO OUTWIT TERRORISTS.
AND HE'S TELLING HIS STORY IN A
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TO OUTWIT TERRORISTS.
AND HE'S TELLING HIS STORY IN A
NEW BOOK, "THE BLACK BANNERS,"
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AND HE'S TELLING HIS STORY IN A
NEW BOOK, "THE BLACK BANNERS,"
PARTS OF WHICH HAVE BEEN BLACKED
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NEW BOOK, "THE BLACK BANNERS,"
PARTS OF WHICH HAVE BEEN BLACKED
OUT BECAUSE THE CIA SAYS THEY
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PARTS OF WHICH HAVE BEEN BLACKED
OUT BECAUSE THE CIA SAYS THEY
CONTAIN CLASSIFIED INFORMATION.
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OUT BECAUSE THE CIA SAYS THEY
CONTAIN CLASSIFIED INFORMATION.
ON THE DAY OF THE SEPTEMBER 11
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CONTAIN CLASSIFIED INFORMATION.
ON THE DAY OF THE SEPTEMBER 11
ATTACKS, ALI SOUFAN WAS
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ON THE DAY OF THE SEPTEMBER 11
ATTACKS, ALI SOUFAN WAS
THOUSANDS OF MILES AWAY FROM
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ATTACKS, ALI SOUFAN WAS
THOUSANDS OF MILES AWAY FROM
GROUND ZERO, BUT IN A UNIQUE
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THOUSANDS OF MILES AWAY FROM
GROUND ZERO, BUT IN A UNIQUE
POSITION TO HELP FIND THOSE
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GROUND ZERO, BUT IN A UNIQUE
POSITION TO HELP FIND THOSE
RESPONSIBLE.
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POSITION TO HELP FIND THOSE
RESPONSIBLE.
WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST THOUGHT?
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RESPONSIBLE.
WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST THOUGHT?
>> Ali Soufan: IT WAS AL QAEDA.
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WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST THOUGHT?
>> Ali Soufan: IT WAS AL QAEDA.
ABSOLUTELY, I HAD NO DOUBT IN MY
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>> Ali Soufan: IT WAS AL QAEDA.
ABSOLUTELY, I HAD NO DOUBT IN MY
MIND.
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ABSOLUTELY, I HAD NO DOUBT IN MY
MIND.
I HAD NO DOUBT IN MY MIND.
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MIND.
I HAD NO DOUBT IN MY MIND.
TWO PLANES AT THE SAME TIME,
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I HAD NO DOUBT IN MY MIND.
TWO PLANES AT THE SAME TIME,
HITTING THE WORLD TRADE CENTER.
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TWO PLANES AT THE SAME TIME,
HITTING THE WORLD TRADE CENTER.
>> Logan: ON 9/11, FBI AGENT ALI
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HITTING THE WORLD TRADE CENTER.
>> Logan: ON 9/11, FBI AGENT ALI
SOUFAN WAS IN YEMEN, WHERE HIS
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>> Logan: ON 9/11, FBI AGENT ALI
SOUFAN WAS IN YEMEN, WHERE HIS
NEW YORK-BASED TEAM HAD BEEN
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SOUFAN WAS IN YEMEN, WHERE HIS
NEW YORK-BASED TEAM HAD BEEN
INVESTIGATING THE DEADLY AL
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NEW YORK-BASED TEAM HAD BEEN
INVESTIGATING THE DEADLY AL
QAEDA ATTACK A YEAR EARLIER ON
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INVESTIGATING THE DEADLY AL
QAEDA ATTACK A YEAR EARLIER ON
THE U.S.S. "COLE."
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QAEDA ATTACK A YEAR EARLIER ON
THE U.S.S. "COLE."
SOUFAN AND HIS TEAM WERE
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THE U.S.S. "COLE."
SOUFAN AND HIS TEAM WERE
PREPARING TO FLY BACK TO NEW
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SOUFAN AND HIS TEAM WERE
PREPARING TO FLY BACK TO NEW
YORK WHEN FBI HEADQUARTERS
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PREPARING TO FLY BACK TO NEW
YORK WHEN FBI HEADQUARTERS
ORDERED HIM AND HIS PARTNER TO
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YORK WHEN FBI HEADQUARTERS
ORDERED HIM AND HIS PARTNER TO
STAY PUT.
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ORDERED HIM AND HIS PARTNER TO
STAY PUT.
AND AT THIS POINT, EVERY FIBER
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STAY PUT.
AND AT THIS POINT, EVERY FIBER
OF YOUR BEING IS SCREAMING,
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AND AT THIS POINT, EVERY FIBER
OF YOUR BEING IS SCREAMING,
"I'VE GOT TO GET BACK TO NEW
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OF YOUR BEING IS SCREAMING,
"I'VE GOT TO GET BACK TO NEW
YORK"?
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"I'VE GOT TO GET BACK TO NEW
YORK"?
>> Soufan: THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I
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YORK"?
>> Soufan: THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I
SAID.
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>> Soufan: THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I
SAID.
I SAID, YOU KNOW, "NEW YORK IS
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SAID.
I SAID, YOU KNOW, "NEW YORK IS
UNDER ATTACK, AMERICA UNDER
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I SAID, YOU KNOW, "NEW YORK IS
UNDER ATTACK, AMERICA UNDER
ATTACK.
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UNDER ATTACK, AMERICA UNDER
ATTACK.
WE CAN INVESTIGATE THE "COLE"
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ATTACK.
WE CAN INVESTIGATE THE "COLE"
SOME OTHER TIME."
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WE CAN INVESTIGATE THE "COLE"
SOME OTHER TIME."
AND THE ANSWER WAS, "NO, ALI,
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SOME OTHER TIME."
AND THE ANSWER WAS, "NO, ALI,
IT'S NOT ABOUT THE "COLE."
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AND THE ANSWER WAS, "NO, ALI,
IT'S NOT ABOUT THE "COLE."
IT'S... IT'S ACTUALLY ABOUT WHAT
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IT'S NOT ABOUT THE "COLE."
IT'S... IT'S ACTUALLY ABOUT WHAT
HAPPENED HERE."
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IT'S... IT'S ACTUALLY ABOUT WHAT
HAPPENED HERE."
AND I WAS FEELING LIKE A KNIFE
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HAPPENED HERE."
AND I WAS FEELING LIKE A KNIFE
GONE IN MY HEART.
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AND I WAS FEELING LIKE A KNIFE
GONE IN MY HEART.
I... I FELT, "WHAT DID WE MISS?
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GONE IN MY HEART.
I... I FELT, "WHAT DID WE MISS?
WHAT DID WE MISS?"
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I... I FELT, "WHAT DID WE MISS?
WHAT DID WE MISS?"
>> Logan: SOUFAN WONDERED
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WHAT DID WE MISS?"
>> Logan: SOUFAN WONDERED
WHETHER HE AND HIS TEAM HAD
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00:03:49,096 --> 00:03:50,462
>> Logan: SOUFAN WONDERED
WHETHER HE AND HIS TEAM HAD
MISSED SOME HINT OF THE 9/11
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00:03:50,464 --> 00:03:51,930
WHETHER HE AND HIS TEAM HAD
MISSED SOME HINT OF THE 9/11
PLOT AS THEY INVESTIGATED THE
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00:03:51,932 --> 00:03:53,799
MISSED SOME HINT OF THE 9/11
PLOT AS THEY INVESTIGATED THE
EARLIER ATTACK ON THE "COLE,"
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00:03:53,801 --> 00:03:55,601
PLOT AS THEY INVESTIGATED THE
EARLIER ATTACK ON THE "COLE,"
AND HIS MISSION IN YEMEN NOW
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00:03:55,603 --> 00:03:57,836
EARLIER ATTACK ON THE "COLE,"
AND HIS MISSION IN YEMEN NOW
TOOK ON A NEW URGENCY.
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00:03:57,838 --> 00:03:59,271
AND HIS MISSION IN YEMEN NOW
TOOK ON A NEW URGENCY.
THERE WERE ALREADY A NUMBER OF
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TOOK ON A NEW URGENCY.
THERE WERE ALREADY A NUMBER OF
AL QAEDA OPERATIVES IN CUSTODY
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00:04:01,742 --> 00:04:03,609
THERE WERE ALREADY A NUMBER OF
AL QAEDA OPERATIVES IN CUSTODY
IN YEMEN, AND FOR THE FBI, ALI
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00:04:03,611 --> 00:04:05,510
AL QAEDA OPERATIVES IN CUSTODY
IN YEMEN, AND FOR THE FBI, ALI
SOUFAN WAS THE RIGHT MAN TO
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00:04:05,512 --> 00:04:07,713
IN YEMEN, AND FOR THE FBI, ALI
SOUFAN WAS THE RIGHT MAN TO
QUESTION THEM ABOUT 9/11.
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00:04:07,715 --> 00:04:09,615
SOUFAN WAS THE RIGHT MAN TO
QUESTION THEM ABOUT 9/11.
HE HAD BEEN INVESTIGATING AL
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00:04:09,617 --> 00:04:10,582
QUESTION THEM ABOUT 9/11.
HE HAD BEEN INVESTIGATING AL
QAEDA FOR FOUR YEARS, AND KNEW A
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00:04:10,584 --> 00:04:12,517
HE HAD BEEN INVESTIGATING AL
QAEDA FOR FOUR YEARS, AND KNEW A
LOT ABOUT ITS OPERATIVES AND ITS
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00:04:12,519 --> 00:04:14,119
QAEDA FOR FOUR YEARS, AND KNEW A
LOT ABOUT ITS OPERATIVES AND ITS
IDEOLOGY.
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00:04:14,121 --> 00:04:16,088
LOT ABOUT ITS OPERATIVES AND ITS
IDEOLOGY.
HE WAS FLUENT IN ARABIC, A
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00:04:16,090 --> 00:04:17,889
IDEOLOGY.
HE WAS FLUENT IN ARABIC, A
MUSLIM HIMSELF, AND AT 30 YEARS
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00:04:17,891 --> 00:04:21,026
HE WAS FLUENT IN ARABIC, A
MUSLIM HIMSELF, AND AT 30 YEARS
OLD, STARTING TO MAKE A NAME FOR
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00:04:21,028 --> 00:04:21,727
MUSLIM HIMSELF, AND AT 30 YEARS
OLD, STARTING TO MAKE A NAME FOR
HIMSELF AS ONE OF THE BUREAU'S
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00:04:21,729 --> 00:04:22,828
OLD, STARTING TO MAKE A NAME FOR
HIMSELF AS ONE OF THE BUREAU'S
BEST INTERROGATORS OF ISLAMIC
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00:04:22,830 --> 00:04:25,897
HIMSELF AS ONE OF THE BUREAU'S
BEST INTERROGATORS OF ISLAMIC
EXTREMISTS.
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00:04:25,899 --> 00:04:27,666
BEST INTERROGATORS OF ISLAMIC
EXTREMISTS.
WHAT MAKES A GOOD INTERVIEWER OR
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00:04:27,668 --> 00:04:29,401
EXTREMISTS.
WHAT MAKES A GOOD INTERVIEWER OR
INTERROGATOR?
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00:04:29,403 --> 00:04:29,935
WHAT MAKES A GOOD INTERVIEWER OR
INTERROGATOR?
>> Soufan: KNOWLEDGE AND
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00:04:29,937 --> 00:04:31,703
INTERROGATOR?
>> Soufan: KNOWLEDGE AND
EMPATHY.
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00:04:31,705 --> 00:04:32,237
>> Soufan: KNOWLEDGE AND
EMPATHY.
I THINK THESE ARE THE TWO
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00:04:32,239 --> 00:04:33,238
EMPATHY.
I THINK THESE ARE THE TWO
THINGS.
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00:04:33,240 --> 00:04:34,473
I THINK THESE ARE THE TWO
THINGS.
YOU NEED TO CONNECT WITH PEOPLE
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00:04:34,475 --> 00:04:36,775
THINGS.
YOU NEED TO CONNECT WITH PEOPLE
ON A HUMAN LEVEL, REGARDLESS IF
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00:04:36,777 --> 00:04:40,245
YOU NEED TO CONNECT WITH PEOPLE
ON A HUMAN LEVEL, REGARDLESS IF
THEY DON'T LIKE YOU, IF THEY
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00:04:40,247 --> 00:04:40,846
ON A HUMAN LEVEL, REGARDLESS IF
THEY DON'T LIKE YOU, IF THEY
WANT TO KILL YOU.
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00:04:40,848 --> 00:04:42,080
THEY DON'T LIKE YOU, IF THEY
WANT TO KILL YOU.
>> Logan: IS IT HARD TO HAVE
151
00:04:42,082 --> 00:04:43,315
WANT TO KILL YOU.
>> Logan: IS IT HARD TO HAVE
EMPATHY WITH SOMEONE WHO'S JUST
152
00:04:43,317 --> 00:04:46,151
>> Logan: IS IT HARD TO HAVE
EMPATHY WITH SOMEONE WHO'S JUST
KILLED, OR HELPED TO KILL,
153
00:04:46,153 --> 00:04:48,387
EMPATHY WITH SOMEONE WHO'S JUST
KILLED, OR HELPED TO KILL,
THOUSANDS OF AMERICANS?
154
00:04:48,389 --> 00:04:49,721
KILLED, OR HELPED TO KILL,
THOUSANDS OF AMERICANS?
>> Soufan: OH, ABSOLUTELY.
155
00:04:49,723 --> 00:04:52,257
THOUSANDS OF AMERICANS?
>> Soufan: OH, ABSOLUTELY.
I WAS WITH ONE GUY WHO'S TELLING
156
00:04:52,259 --> 00:04:52,891
>> Soufan: OH, ABSOLUTELY.
I WAS WITH ONE GUY WHO'S TELLING
ME HE WANT TO SLAUGHTER ME LIKE
157
00:04:52,893 --> 00:04:53,325
I WAS WITH ONE GUY WHO'S TELLING
ME HE WANT TO SLAUGHTER ME LIKE
A SHEEP.
158
00:04:53,327 --> 00:04:53,925
ME HE WANT TO SLAUGHTER ME LIKE
A SHEEP.
>> Logan: WHAT DID YOU SAY TO
159
00:04:53,927 --> 00:04:54,293
A SHEEP.
>> Logan: WHAT DID YOU SAY TO
HIM?
160
00:04:54,295 --> 00:04:55,560
>> Logan: WHAT DID YOU SAY TO
HIM?
>> Soufan: I KIND OF, LIKE,
161
00:04:55,562 --> 00:04:57,729
HIM?
>> Soufan: I KIND OF, LIKE,
POLITELY PUT HIM IN HIS PLACE.
162
00:04:57,731 --> 00:04:58,930
>> Soufan: I KIND OF, LIKE,
POLITELY PUT HIM IN HIS PLACE.
>> Logan: I WOULD LIKE TO
163
00:04:58,932 --> 00:04:59,998
POLITELY PUT HIM IN HIS PLACE.
>> Logan: I WOULD LIKE TO
UNDERSTAND WHAT "POLITELY PUT
164
00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:01,967
>> Logan: I WOULD LIKE TO
UNDERSTAND WHAT "POLITELY PUT
HIM IN HIS PLACE" MEANS.
165
00:05:01,969 --> 00:05:03,168
UNDERSTAND WHAT "POLITELY PUT
HIM IN HIS PLACE" MEANS.
>> Soufan: WE HAD A FRUIT NEXT
166
00:05:03,170 --> 00:05:03,802
HIM IN HIS PLACE" MEANS.
>> Soufan: WE HAD A FRUIT NEXT
TO US AND THERE'S A KNIFE TO CUT
167
00:05:03,804 --> 00:05:04,836
>> Soufan: WE HAD A FRUIT NEXT
TO US AND THERE'S A KNIFE TO CUT
THE FRUIT.
168
00:05:04,838 --> 00:05:05,671
TO US AND THERE'S A KNIFE TO CUT
THE FRUIT.
I GAVE HIM THE KNIFE.
169
00:05:05,673 --> 00:05:07,406
THE FRUIT.
I GAVE HIM THE KNIFE.
I SAID, "GO AHEAD AND DO IT
170
00:05:07,408 --> 00:05:08,273
I GAVE HIM THE KNIFE.
I SAID, "GO AHEAD AND DO IT
NOW."
171
00:05:08,275 --> 00:05:09,541
I SAID, "GO AHEAD AND DO IT
NOW."
HE LOOKED AT ME.
172
00:05:09,543 --> 00:05:11,310
NOW."
HE LOOKED AT ME.
I SAID, "I THOUGHT SO.
173
00:05:11,312 --> 00:05:11,977
HE LOOKED AT ME.
I SAID, "I THOUGHT SO.
SO SIT DOWN AND SHUT YOUR MOUTH
174
00:05:11,979 --> 00:05:12,978
I SAID, "I THOUGHT SO.
SO SIT DOWN AND SHUT YOUR MOUTH
AND LET'S TALK."
175
00:05:12,980 --> 00:05:13,612
SO SIT DOWN AND SHUT YOUR MOUTH
AND LET'S TALK."
>> Logan: ARE THEY TRYING TO
176
00:05:13,614 --> 00:05:15,213
AND LET'S TALK."
>> Logan: ARE THEY TRYING TO
TURN THE SITUATION AROUND?
177
00:05:15,215 --> 00:05:15,947
>> Logan: ARE THEY TRYING TO
TURN THE SITUATION AROUND?
ARE THEY TRYING TO TURN IT ON
178
00:05:15,949 --> 00:05:16,481
TURN THE SITUATION AROUND?
ARE THEY TRYING TO TURN IT ON
YOU?
179
00:05:16,483 --> 00:05:17,182
ARE THEY TRYING TO TURN IT ON
YOU?
>> Soufan: WELL, YOU KNOW WHAT?
180
00:05:17,184 --> 00:05:18,583
YOU?
>> Soufan: WELL, YOU KNOW WHAT?
THERE IS SOMETHING THAT THEY
181
00:05:18,585 --> 00:05:19,384
>> Soufan: WELL, YOU KNOW WHAT?
THERE IS SOMETHING THAT THEY
DON'T EXPECT WHEN THEY ARE...
182
00:05:19,386 --> 00:05:19,985
THERE IS SOMETHING THAT THEY
DON'T EXPECT WHEN THEY ARE...
THEY ARE BEING INTERROGATED BY
183
00:05:19,987 --> 00:05:22,721
DON'T EXPECT WHEN THEY ARE...
THEY ARE BEING INTERROGATED BY
AMERICANS.
184
00:05:22,723 --> 00:05:23,655
THEY ARE BEING INTERROGATED BY
AMERICANS.
THEY DON'T EXPECT A PERSON COMES
185
00:05:23,657 --> 00:05:25,023
AMERICANS.
THEY DON'T EXPECT A PERSON COMES
WITH THEM.
186
00:05:25,025 --> 00:05:26,124
THEY DON'T EXPECT A PERSON COMES
WITH THEM.
THEY HAVE, LIKE, TEA, THEY HAVE
187
00:05:26,126 --> 00:05:27,726
WITH THEM.
THEY HAVE, LIKE, TEA, THEY HAVE
COFFEE-- SIT DOWN, TALK, TRYING
188
00:05:27,728 --> 00:05:29,027
THEY HAVE, LIKE, TEA, THEY HAVE
COFFEE-- SIT DOWN, TALK, TRYING
TO KNOW EACH OTHER, TRYING TO
189
00:05:29,029 --> 00:05:30,128
COFFEE-- SIT DOWN, TALK, TRYING
TO KNOW EACH OTHER, TRYING TO
BUILD A RAPPORT.
190
00:05:30,130 --> 00:05:30,796
TO KNOW EACH OTHER, TRYING TO
BUILD A RAPPORT.
AND THAT SCARES THEM, THAT
191
00:05:30,798 --> 00:05:33,432
BUILD A RAPPORT.
AND THAT SCARES THEM, THAT
SHAKES THEM.
192
00:05:33,434 --> 00:05:34,700
AND THAT SCARES THEM, THAT
SHAKES THEM.
BECAUSE THEY WERE TRAINED THAT
193
00:05:34,702 --> 00:05:36,268
SHAKES THEM.
BECAUSE THEY WERE TRAINED THAT
WE ARE SO EVIL, AND WE TORTURE
194
00:05:36,270 --> 00:05:39,604
BECAUSE THEY WERE TRAINED THAT
WE ARE SO EVIL, AND WE TORTURE
AND WE KILL.
195
00:05:39,606 --> 00:05:40,205
WE ARE SO EVIL, AND WE TORTURE
AND WE KILL.
AND THAT IS THE REASON OF THE
196
00:05:40,207 --> 00:05:42,574
AND WE KILL.
AND THAT IS THE REASON OF THE
RAGE AGAINST US.
197
00:05:42,576 --> 00:05:44,242
AND THAT IS THE REASON OF THE
RAGE AGAINST US.
SO THEY TELL YOU A LOT OF STUFF
198
00:05:44,244 --> 00:05:45,077
RAGE AGAINST US.
SO THEY TELL YOU A LOT OF STUFF
TO PISS YOU OFF, AND THEN THEY
199
00:05:45,079 --> 00:05:46,244
SO THEY TELL YOU A LOT OF STUFF
TO PISS YOU OFF, AND THEN THEY
CAN SAY, "SEE?
200
00:05:46,246 --> 00:05:47,346
TO PISS YOU OFF, AND THEN THEY
CAN SAY, "SEE?
HE IS EVIL."
201
00:05:47,348 --> 00:05:50,115
CAN SAY, "SEE?
HE IS EVIL."
SO IN MY CASE, I TRY TO DEPRIVE
202
00:05:50,117 --> 00:05:52,017
HE IS EVIL."
SO IN MY CASE, I TRY TO DEPRIVE
THEM FROM THAT.
203
00:05:52,019 --> 00:05:53,018
SO IN MY CASE, I TRY TO DEPRIVE
THEM FROM THAT.
>> Logan: DO YOU THINK THE FACT
204
00:05:53,020 --> 00:05:54,586
THEM FROM THAT.
>> Logan: DO YOU THINK THE FACT
THAT YOU WERE A MUSLIM GAVE YOU
205
00:05:54,588 --> 00:05:57,155
>> Logan: DO YOU THINK THE FACT
THAT YOU WERE A MUSLIM GAVE YOU
AN ADVANTAGE IN SOME CASES AND
206
00:05:57,157 --> 00:05:58,490
THAT YOU WERE A MUSLIM GAVE YOU
AN ADVANTAGE IN SOME CASES AND
IN SOME WAYS?
207
00:05:58,492 --> 00:05:59,658
AN ADVANTAGE IN SOME CASES AND
IN SOME WAYS?
>> Soufan: NO.
208
00:05:59,660 --> 00:06:02,527
IN SOME WAYS?
>> Soufan: NO.
BUT THE FACT THAT MAYBE I
209
00:06:02,529 --> 00:06:03,929
>> Soufan: NO.
BUT THE FACT THAT MAYBE I
UNDERSTOOD THE CULTURE, THE FACT
210
00:06:03,931 --> 00:06:05,530
BUT THE FACT THAT MAYBE I
UNDERSTOOD THE CULTURE, THE FACT
THAT I GENUINELY, AS A PERSON,
211
00:06:05,532 --> 00:06:06,998
UNDERSTOOD THE CULTURE, THE FACT
THAT I GENUINELY, AS A PERSON,
HAVE AN INTEREST IN THESE KIND
212
00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:07,632
THAT I GENUINELY, AS A PERSON,
HAVE AN INTEREST IN THESE KIND
OF THINGS, THAT PROBABLY HELPED
213
00:06:07,634 --> 00:06:10,068
HAVE AN INTEREST IN THESE KIND
OF THINGS, THAT PROBABLY HELPED
ME.
214
00:06:10,070 --> 00:06:11,069
OF THINGS, THAT PROBABLY HELPED
ME.
>> Logan: THERE HAS BEEN TIMES
215
00:06:11,071 --> 00:06:12,070
ME.
>> Logan: THERE HAS BEEN TIMES
WHERE YOU'VE GOT INTO REALLY
216
00:06:12,072 --> 00:06:12,471
>> Logan: THERE HAS BEEN TIMES
WHERE YOU'VE GOT INTO REALLY
DEEP, RELIGIOUS...
217
00:06:12,473 --> 00:06:13,238
WHERE YOU'VE GOT INTO REALLY
DEEP, RELIGIOUS...
>> Soufan: RIGHT.
218
00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:14,106
DEEP, RELIGIOUS...
>> Soufan: RIGHT.
>> Logan: ...ARGUMENTS WITH SOME
219
00:06:14,108 --> 00:06:15,507
>> Soufan: RIGHT.
>> Logan: ...ARGUMENTS WITH SOME
PRETTY HIGH-LEVEL BAD GUYS.
220
00:06:15,509 --> 00:06:16,575
>> Logan: ...ARGUMENTS WITH SOME
PRETTY HIGH-LEVEL BAD GUYS.
>> Soufan: WELL, IT HAPPENED
221
00:06:16,577 --> 00:06:17,576
PRETTY HIGH-LEVEL BAD GUYS.
>> Soufan: WELL, IT HAPPENED
FREQUENTLY, YEAH.
222
00:06:17,578 --> 00:06:18,143
>> Soufan: WELL, IT HAPPENED
FREQUENTLY, YEAH.
>> Logan: DID YOU WIN THOSE
223
00:06:18,145 --> 00:06:19,444
FREQUENTLY, YEAH.
>> Logan: DID YOU WIN THOSE
ARGUMENTS?
224
00:06:19,446 --> 00:06:20,112
>> Logan: DID YOU WIN THOSE
ARGUMENTS?
>> Soufan: WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF
225
00:06:20,114 --> 00:06:23,415
ARGUMENTS?
>> Soufan: WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF
I CONVINCED THEM.
226
00:06:23,417 --> 00:06:24,116
>> Soufan: WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF
I CONVINCED THEM.
BUT I KNOW, TOWARDS THE END, I
227
00:06:24,118 --> 00:06:25,317
I CONVINCED THEM.
BUT I KNOW, TOWARDS THE END, I
HAVE MY CONFESSION AND THAT
228
00:06:25,319 --> 00:06:30,122
BUT I KNOW, TOWARDS THE END, I
HAVE MY CONFESSION AND THAT
WHAT'S I CARE ABOUT.
229
00:06:30,124 --> 00:06:30,622
HAVE MY CONFESSION AND THAT
WHAT'S I CARE ABOUT.
( LAUGHTER )
230
00:06:30,624 --> 00:06:31,223
WHAT'S I CARE ABOUT.
( LAUGHTER )
>> Logan: JUST ONE WEEK AFTER
231
00:06:31,225 --> 00:06:31,990
( LAUGHTER )
>> Logan: JUST ONE WEEK AFTER
9/11, SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER
232
00:06:31,992 --> 00:06:33,091
>> Logan: JUST ONE WEEK AFTER
9/11, SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER
FOUND THEMSELVES FACE TO FACE
233
00:06:33,093 --> 00:06:34,559
9/11, SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER
FOUND THEMSELVES FACE TO FACE
WITH OSAMA BIN LADEN'S
234
00:06:34,561 --> 00:06:36,795
FOUND THEMSELVES FACE TO FACE
WITH OSAMA BIN LADEN'S
BODYGUARD, ABU JANDAL.
235
00:06:36,797 --> 00:06:37,829
WITH OSAMA BIN LADEN'S
BODYGUARD, ABU JANDAL.
HE'D BEEN CAUGHT AND IMPRISONED
236
00:06:37,831 --> 00:06:39,131
BODYGUARD, ABU JANDAL.
HE'D BEEN CAUGHT AND IMPRISONED
IN YEMEN NEARLY SEVEN MONTHS
237
00:06:39,133 --> 00:06:41,299
HE'D BEEN CAUGHT AND IMPRISONED
IN YEMEN NEARLY SEVEN MONTHS
BEFORE 9/11, BUT NOW THAT BIN
238
00:06:41,301 --> 00:06:44,536
IN YEMEN NEARLY SEVEN MONTHS
BEFORE 9/11, BUT NOW THAT BIN
LADEN HAD ATTACKED ON U.S. SOIL,
239
00:06:44,538 --> 00:06:45,137
BEFORE 9/11, BUT NOW THAT BIN
LADEN HAD ATTACKED ON U.S. SOIL,
IT WAS IMPORTANT TO SEE IF ABU
240
00:06:45,139 --> 00:06:47,105
LADEN HAD ATTACKED ON U.S. SOIL,
IT WAS IMPORTANT TO SEE IF ABU
JANDAL COULD HELP THE FBI BUILD
241
00:06:47,107 --> 00:06:48,974
IT WAS IMPORTANT TO SEE IF ABU
JANDAL COULD HELP THE FBI BUILD
A CASE AGAINST THOSE
242
00:06:48,976 --> 00:06:51,576
JANDAL COULD HELP THE FBI BUILD
A CASE AGAINST THOSE
RESPONSIBLE.
243
00:06:51,578 --> 00:06:53,011
A CASE AGAINST THOSE
RESPONSIBLE.
>> Soufan: HE WALKED, SAT IN HIS
244
00:06:53,013 --> 00:06:53,612
RESPONSIBLE.
>> Soufan: HE WALKED, SAT IN HIS
CHAIR, AND LITERALLY MOVED THE
245
00:06:53,614 --> 00:06:58,717
>> Soufan: HE WALKED, SAT IN HIS
CHAIR, AND LITERALLY MOVED THE
CHAIR TOWARDS THE TWO YEMENI
246
00:06:58,719 --> 00:07:01,620
CHAIR, AND LITERALLY MOVED THE
CHAIR TOWARDS THE TWO YEMENI
INTERROGATORS THAT'S THERE.
247
00:07:01,622 --> 00:07:02,320
CHAIR TOWARDS THE TWO YEMENI
INTERROGATORS THAT'S THERE.
AND HE SAID, "I DON'T
248
00:07:02,322 --> 00:07:03,288
INTERROGATORS THAT'S THERE.
AND HE SAID, "I DON'T
ACKNOWLEDGE THEM.
249
00:07:03,290 --> 00:07:03,822
AND HE SAID, "I DON'T
ACKNOWLEDGE THEM.
I DON'T ACKNOWLEDGE THEIR
250
00:07:03,824 --> 00:07:04,956
ACKNOWLEDGE THEM.
I DON'T ACKNOWLEDGE THEIR
EXISTENCE."
251
00:07:04,958 --> 00:07:05,557
I DON'T ACKNOWLEDGE THEIR
EXISTENCE."
>> Logan: AND WHY IS HE DOING
252
00:07:05,559 --> 00:07:06,792
EXISTENCE."
>> Logan: AND WHY IS HE DOING
THAT?
253
00:07:06,794 --> 00:07:07,426
>> Logan: AND WHY IS HE DOING
THAT?
>> Soufan: HE HATE US.
254
00:07:07,428 --> 00:07:09,728
THAT?
>> Soufan: HE HATE US.
HE HATE AMERICANS.
255
00:07:09,730 --> 00:07:10,462
>> Soufan: HE HATE US.
HE HATE AMERICANS.
>> Logan: SO HOW DID YOU GET HIM
256
00:07:10,464 --> 00:07:11,096
HE HATE AMERICANS.
>> Logan: SO HOW DID YOU GET HIM
TO OPEN UP?
257
00:07:11,098 --> 00:07:11,630
>> Logan: SO HOW DID YOU GET HIM
TO OPEN UP?
>> Soufan: WELL, IT WAS A
258
00:07:11,632 --> 00:07:12,531
TO OPEN UP?
>> Soufan: WELL, IT WAS A
PROCESS.
259
00:07:12,533 --> 00:07:13,465
>> Soufan: WELL, IT WAS A
PROCESS.
WE WERE ABLE TO BUILD A RAPPORT
260
00:07:13,467 --> 00:07:15,233
PROCESS.
WE WERE ABLE TO BUILD A RAPPORT
WITH HIM.
261
00:07:15,235 --> 00:07:17,769
WE WERE ABLE TO BUILD A RAPPORT
WITH HIM.
AND HE TALKED A LOT ABOUT, YOU
262
00:07:17,771 --> 00:07:19,070
WITH HIM.
AND HE TALKED A LOT ABOUT, YOU
KNOW, REVOLUTIONS AND THE
263
00:07:19,072 --> 00:07:21,440
AND HE TALKED A LOT ABOUT, YOU
KNOW, REVOLUTIONS AND THE
HISTORY OF REVOLUTIONS.
264
00:07:21,442 --> 00:07:22,274
KNOW, REVOLUTIONS AND THE
HISTORY OF REVOLUTIONS.
SO I START TELLING HIM ABOUT THE
265
00:07:22,276 --> 00:07:24,609
HISTORY OF REVOLUTIONS.
SO I START TELLING HIM ABOUT THE
AMERICAN REVOLUTION, TOO.
266
00:07:24,611 --> 00:07:26,011
SO I START TELLING HIM ABOUT THE
AMERICAN REVOLUTION, TOO.
AND WE GOT HIM A BOOK IN ARABIC
267
00:07:26,013 --> 00:07:27,078
AMERICAN REVOLUTION, TOO.
AND WE GOT HIM A BOOK IN ARABIC
ABOUT GEORGE WASHINGTON AND THE
268
00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:28,713
AND WE GOT HIM A BOOK IN ARABIC
ABOUT GEORGE WASHINGTON AND THE
AMERICAN REVOLUTION THAT HE
269
00:07:28,715 --> 00:07:29,247
ABOUT GEORGE WASHINGTON AND THE
AMERICAN REVOLUTION THAT HE
ACTUALLY STAYED ALL NIGHT
270
00:07:29,249 --> 00:07:30,148
AMERICAN REVOLUTION THAT HE
ACTUALLY STAYED ALL NIGHT
READING.
271
00:07:30,150 --> 00:07:32,884
ACTUALLY STAYED ALL NIGHT
READING.
HE WAS FASCINATED BY IT.
272
00:07:32,886 --> 00:07:34,085
READING.
HE WAS FASCINATED BY IT.
BUT HE'S PRACTICING TYPICAL
273
00:07:34,087 --> 00:07:35,754
HE WAS FASCINATED BY IT.
BUT HE'S PRACTICING TYPICAL
COUNTER-INTERROGATION
274
00:07:35,756 --> 00:07:39,291
BUT HE'S PRACTICING TYPICAL
COUNTER-INTERROGATION
TECHNIQUES, WHERE HE GIVES YOU
275
00:07:39,293 --> 00:07:41,226
COUNTER-INTERROGATION
TECHNIQUES, WHERE HE GIVES YOU
WHAT HE THINKS YOU KNOW SO YOU
276
00:07:41,228 --> 00:07:42,694
TECHNIQUES, WHERE HE GIVES YOU
WHAT HE THINKS YOU KNOW SO YOU
WILL THINK HE'S COOPERATING.
277
00:07:42,696 --> 00:07:43,829
WHAT HE THINKS YOU KNOW SO YOU
WILL THINK HE'S COOPERATING.
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS WHEN ABU
278
00:07:43,831 --> 00:07:44,830
WILL THINK HE'S COOPERATING.
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS WHEN ABU
JANDAL LOOKED AT A BOOK OF
279
00:07:44,832 --> 00:07:45,330
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS WHEN ABU
JANDAL LOOKED AT A BOOK OF
PHOTOS OF KNOWN AL QAEDA
280
00:07:45,332 --> 00:07:48,567
JANDAL LOOKED AT A BOOK OF
PHOTOS OF KNOWN AL QAEDA
MEMBERS, HE IDENTIFIED VERY FEW
281
00:07:48,569 --> 00:07:53,438
PHOTOS OF KNOWN AL QAEDA
MEMBERS, HE IDENTIFIED VERY FEW
AND KEPT PASSING OVER THE PHOTO
282
00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:55,073
MEMBERS, HE IDENTIFIED VERY FEW
AND KEPT PASSING OVER THE PHOTO
OF THIS MAN, MARWAN AL SHEHHI,
283
00:07:55,075 --> 00:07:58,009
AND KEPT PASSING OVER THE PHOTO
OF THIS MAN, MARWAN AL SHEHHI,
ONE OF THE 9/11 HIJACKERS.
284
00:07:58,011 --> 00:08:00,745
OF THIS MAN, MARWAN AL SHEHHI,
ONE OF THE 9/11 HIJACKERS.
SOUFAN KNEW ABU JANDAL HAD CARED
285
00:08:00,747 --> 00:08:01,446
ONE OF THE 9/11 HIJACKERS.
SOUFAN KNEW ABU JANDAL HAD CARED
FOR EL SHEHHI YEARS AGO WHEN HE
286
00:08:01,448 --> 00:08:03,148
SOUFAN KNEW ABU JANDAL HAD CARED
FOR EL SHEHHI YEARS AGO WHEN HE
WAS VERY SICK.
287
00:08:03,150 --> 00:08:04,916
FOR EL SHEHHI YEARS AGO WHEN HE
WAS VERY SICK.
SO THE FACT THAT HE WAS NOT
288
00:08:04,918 --> 00:08:06,284
WAS VERY SICK.
SO THE FACT THAT HE WAS NOT
IDENTIFYING HIM IMMEDIATELY WAS
289
00:08:06,286 --> 00:08:07,052
SO THE FACT THAT HE WAS NOT
IDENTIFYING HIM IMMEDIATELY WAS
A SIGNAL TO YOU THAT HE WAS NOT
290
00:08:07,054 --> 00:08:07,619
IDENTIFYING HIM IMMEDIATELY WAS
A SIGNAL TO YOU THAT HE WAS NOT
BEING HONEST?
291
00:08:07,621 --> 00:08:09,054
A SIGNAL TO YOU THAT HE WAS NOT
BEING HONEST?
>> Soufan: EXACTLY.
292
00:08:09,056 --> 00:08:10,589
BEING HONEST?
>> Soufan: EXACTLY.
SO I SAID TO HIM, "SO YOU WANT
293
00:08:10,591 --> 00:08:11,189
>> Soufan: EXACTLY.
SO I SAID TO HIM, "SO YOU WANT
TO TELL ME YOU DON'T KNOW THIS
294
00:08:11,191 --> 00:08:13,391
SO I SAID TO HIM, "SO YOU WANT
TO TELL ME YOU DON'T KNOW THIS
GUY?
295
00:08:13,393 --> 00:08:16,561
TO TELL ME YOU DON'T KNOW THIS
GUY?
KANDAHAR, DECEMBER 1999,
296
00:08:16,563 --> 00:08:19,431
GUY?
KANDAHAR, DECEMBER 1999,
RAMADAN.
297
00:08:19,433 --> 00:08:20,932
KANDAHAR, DECEMBER 1999,
RAMADAN.
HE GOT VERY SICK.
298
00:08:20,934 --> 00:08:24,603
RAMADAN.
HE GOT VERY SICK.
YOU WERE NURSING HIM AND PUTTING
299
00:08:24,605 --> 00:08:25,337
HE GOT VERY SICK.
YOU WERE NURSING HIM AND PUTTING
SOUP ON HIS LIPS, SO HE WON'T
300
00:08:25,339 --> 00:08:26,671
YOU WERE NURSING HIM AND PUTTING
SOUP ON HIS LIPS, SO HE WON'T
GET DEHYDRATED."
301
00:08:26,673 --> 00:08:28,440
SOUP ON HIS LIPS, SO HE WON'T
GET DEHYDRATED."
I TOOK THE BOOK.
302
00:08:28,442 --> 00:08:31,576
GET DEHYDRATED."
I TOOK THE BOOK.
I SAID, "LET ME MAKE IT VERY
303
00:08:31,578 --> 00:08:33,345
I TOOK THE BOOK.
I SAID, "LET ME MAKE IT VERY
CLEAR TO YOU.
304
00:08:33,347 --> 00:08:34,813
I SAID, "LET ME MAKE IT VERY
CLEAR TO YOU.
YOU DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE
305
00:08:34,815 --> 00:08:37,249
CLEAR TO YOU.
YOU DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE
IN THE BOOK WORKS FOR ME.
306
00:08:37,251 --> 00:08:39,518
YOU DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE
IN THE BOOK WORKS FOR ME.
YOU DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE
307
00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:40,852
IN THE BOOK WORKS FOR ME.
YOU DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE
IN THE BOOK WE CAUGHT AND
308
00:08:40,854 --> 00:08:43,221
YOU DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE
IN THE BOOK WE CAUGHT AND
THEY'RE COOPERATING.
309
00:08:43,223 --> 00:08:44,756
IN THE BOOK WE CAUGHT AND
THEY'RE COOPERATING.
AND THAT IS THE CARD THAT I HAVE
310
00:08:44,758 --> 00:08:45,390
THEY'RE COOPERATING.
AND THAT IS THE CARD THAT I HAVE
TO KNOW IF YOU'RE COOPERATING OR
311
00:08:45,392 --> 00:08:46,992
AND THAT IS THE CARD THAT I HAVE
TO KNOW IF YOU'RE COOPERATING OR
NOT.
312
00:08:46,994 --> 00:08:47,659
TO KNOW IF YOU'RE COOPERATING OR
NOT.
WHY DON'T YOU LOOK AT THE BOOK
313
00:08:47,661 --> 00:08:48,793
NOT.
WHY DON'T YOU LOOK AT THE BOOK
AGAIN?"
314
00:08:48,795 --> 00:08:49,961
WHY DON'T YOU LOOK AT THE BOOK
AGAIN?"
HE IDENTIFIED ALMOST EVERYONE IN
315
00:08:49,963 --> 00:08:51,363
AGAIN?"
HE IDENTIFIED ALMOST EVERYONE IN
THE BOOK.
316
00:08:51,365 --> 00:08:52,564
HE IDENTIFIED ALMOST EVERYONE IN
THE BOOK.
>> Logan: AMONG THOSE ABU JANDAL
317
00:08:52,566 --> 00:08:54,432
THE BOOK.
>> Logan: AMONG THOSE ABU JANDAL
IDENTIFIED AS AL QAEDA MEMBERS
318
00:08:54,434 --> 00:08:55,834
>> Logan: AMONG THOSE ABU JANDAL
IDENTIFIED AS AL QAEDA MEMBERS
WERE SEVEN OF THE TERRORISTS WHO
319
00:08:55,836 --> 00:08:56,468
IDENTIFIED AS AL QAEDA MEMBERS
WERE SEVEN OF THE TERRORISTS WHO
FLEW PLANES INTO THE WORLD TRADE
320
00:08:56,470 --> 00:08:59,738
WERE SEVEN OF THE TERRORISTS WHO
FLEW PLANES INTO THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER AND THE PENTAGON.
321
00:08:59,740 --> 00:09:00,805
FLEW PLANES INTO THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER AND THE PENTAGON.
ABU JANDAL DIDN'T KNOW THEY HAD
322
00:09:00,807 --> 00:09:02,307
CENTER AND THE PENTAGON.
ABU JANDAL DIDN'T KNOW THEY HAD
BEEN INVOLVED IN THE 9/11 PLOT
323
00:09:02,309 --> 00:09:03,942
ABU JANDAL DIDN'T KNOW THEY HAD
BEEN INVOLVED IN THE 9/11 PLOT
BECAUSE HE'D BEEN IN PRISON, AND
324
00:09:03,944 --> 00:09:04,910
BEEN INVOLVED IN THE 9/11 PLOT
BECAUSE HE'D BEEN IN PRISON, AND
HE INSISTED THAT AL QAEDA WAS
325
00:09:04,912 --> 00:09:08,179
BECAUSE HE'D BEEN IN PRISON, AND
HE INSISTED THAT AL QAEDA WAS
NOT BEHIND THE ATTACK.
326
00:09:08,181 --> 00:09:09,080
HE INSISTED THAT AL QAEDA WAS
NOT BEHIND THE ATTACK.
HE DIDN'T BELIEVE IT?
327
00:09:09,082 --> 00:09:10,181
NOT BEHIND THE ATTACK.
HE DIDN'T BELIEVE IT?
>> Soufan: HE WAS VERY ADAMANT
328
00:09:10,183 --> 00:09:11,883
HE DIDN'T BELIEVE IT?
>> Soufan: HE WAS VERY ADAMANT
THAT BIN LADEN DIDN'T DO IT.
329
00:09:11,885 --> 00:09:15,787
>> Soufan: HE WAS VERY ADAMANT
THAT BIN LADEN DIDN'T DO IT.
>> Logan: SO WHAT HAPPENS THEN?
330
00:09:15,789 --> 00:09:16,421
THAT BIN LADEN DIDN'T DO IT.
>> Logan: SO WHAT HAPPENS THEN?
>> Soufan: I SAID, "WELL, I KNOW
331
00:09:16,423 --> 00:09:16,955
>> Logan: SO WHAT HAPPENS THEN?
>> Soufan: I SAID, "WELL, I KNOW
THAT AL QAEDA DID THAT.
332
00:09:16,957 --> 00:09:17,422
>> Soufan: I SAID, "WELL, I KNOW
THAT AL QAEDA DID THAT.
SOMEONE TOLD ME."
333
00:09:17,424 --> 00:09:17,989
THAT AL QAEDA DID THAT.
SOMEONE TOLD ME."
HE SAID, "WHO TOLD YOU?"
334
00:09:17,991 --> 00:09:18,456
SOMEONE TOLD ME."
HE SAID, "WHO TOLD YOU?"
I SAID, "YOU DID."
335
00:09:18,458 --> 00:09:19,057
HE SAID, "WHO TOLD YOU?"
I SAID, "YOU DID."
AND HE GETS SO MAD.
336
00:09:19,059 --> 00:09:19,658
I SAID, "YOU DID."
AND HE GETS SO MAD.
"YOU'RE PUTTING WORDS IN MY
337
00:09:19,660 --> 00:09:20,392
AND HE GETS SO MAD.
"YOU'RE PUTTING WORDS IN MY
MOUTH.
338
00:09:20,394 --> 00:09:22,561
"YOU'RE PUTTING WORDS IN MY
MOUTH.
I NEVER SAID AL QAEDA DID THAT."
339
00:09:22,563 --> 00:09:23,962
MOUTH.
I NEVER SAID AL QAEDA DID THAT."
I SAID, "DO YOU KNOW WHO FLEW
340
00:09:23,964 --> 00:09:24,930
I NEVER SAID AL QAEDA DID THAT."
I SAID, "DO YOU KNOW WHO FLEW
THE PLANES INTO THE WORLD TRADE
341
00:09:24,932 --> 00:09:27,265
I SAID, "DO YOU KNOW WHO FLEW
THE PLANES INTO THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER AND THE PENTAGON?"
342
00:09:27,267 --> 00:09:28,300
THE PLANES INTO THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER AND THE PENTAGON?"
AND I TOOK THE SEVEN PHOTOS THAT
343
00:09:28,302 --> 00:09:30,068
CENTER AND THE PENTAGON?"
AND I TOOK THE SEVEN PHOTOS THAT
HE IDENTIFIED AND PUT IT IN
344
00:09:30,070 --> 00:09:31,469
AND I TOOK THE SEVEN PHOTOS THAT
HE IDENTIFIED AND PUT IT IN
FRONT OF HIM.
345
00:09:31,471 --> 00:09:32,871
HE IDENTIFIED AND PUT IT IN
FRONT OF HIM.
I SAID, "THOSE, MY FRIEND, ARE
346
00:09:32,873 --> 00:09:34,573
FRONT OF HIM.
I SAID, "THOSE, MY FRIEND, ARE
NOT MY SOURCES; THOSE ARE THE
347
00:09:34,575 --> 00:09:37,576
I SAID, "THOSE, MY FRIEND, ARE
NOT MY SOURCES; THOSE ARE THE
PEOPLE WHO FLEW THE PLANES."
348
00:09:37,578 --> 00:09:38,043
NOT MY SOURCES; THOSE ARE THE
PEOPLE WHO FLEW THE PLANES."
HE TOTALLY COLLAPSED.
349
00:09:38,045 --> 00:09:39,377
PEOPLE WHO FLEW THE PLANES."
HE TOTALLY COLLAPSED.
>> Logan: HE COLLAPSED?
350
00:09:39,379 --> 00:09:40,712
HE TOTALLY COLLAPSED.
>> Logan: HE COLLAPSED?
>> Soufan: HE PUT HIS HANDS LIKE
351
00:09:40,714 --> 00:09:43,114
>> Logan: HE COLLAPSED?
>> Soufan: HE PUT HIS HANDS LIKE
THIS ON HIS FACE AND WENT DOWN.
352
00:09:43,116 --> 00:09:45,116
>> Soufan: HE PUT HIS HANDS LIKE
THIS ON HIS FACE AND WENT DOWN.
AND HE STARTS SHAKING.
353
00:09:45,118 --> 00:09:46,284
THIS ON HIS FACE AND WENT DOWN.
AND HE STARTS SHAKING.
HE KNEW WHAT HE DID.
354
00:09:46,286 --> 00:09:47,852
AND HE STARTS SHAKING.
HE KNEW WHAT HE DID.
>> Logan: HE KNEW THAT HE...
355
00:09:47,854 --> 00:09:48,720
HE KNEW WHAT HE DID.
>> Logan: HE KNEW THAT HE...
>> Soufan: HE JUST GAVE UP BIN
356
00:09:48,722 --> 00:09:49,821
>> Logan: HE KNEW THAT HE...
>> Soufan: HE JUST GAVE UP BIN
LADEN, HE JUST GAVE UP AL QAEDA
357
00:09:49,823 --> 00:09:51,122
>> Soufan: HE JUST GAVE UP BIN
LADEN, HE JUST GAVE UP AL QAEDA
ON 9/11.
358
00:09:51,124 --> 00:09:52,724
LADEN, HE JUST GAVE UP AL QAEDA
ON 9/11.
AND AFTER THAT, THE LEVEL OF
359
00:09:52,726 --> 00:09:55,894
ON 9/11.
AND AFTER THAT, THE LEVEL OF
COOPERATION WAS VERY DIFFERENT.
360
00:09:55,896 --> 00:09:58,763
AND AFTER THAT, THE LEVEL OF
COOPERATION WAS VERY DIFFERENT.
WE ENDED UP SPENDING DAYS AND
361
00:09:58,765 --> 00:10:01,299
COOPERATION WAS VERY DIFFERENT.
WE ENDED UP SPENDING DAYS AND
DAYS WITH HIM.
362
00:10:01,301 --> 00:10:02,734
WE ENDED UP SPENDING DAYS AND
DAYS WITH HIM.
>> Logan: ABU JANDAL PROVIDED
363
00:10:02,736 --> 00:10:04,269
DAYS WITH HIM.
>> Logan: ABU JANDAL PROVIDED
NEARLY 100 PAGES OF INFORMATION,
364
00:10:04,271 --> 00:10:07,238
>> Logan: ABU JANDAL PROVIDED
NEARLY 100 PAGES OF INFORMATION,
ACCORDING TO SOUFAN'S FBI
365
00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:08,273
NEARLY 100 PAGES OF INFORMATION,
ACCORDING TO SOUFAN'S FBI
REPORT, INCLUDING INTRICATE
366
00:10:08,275 --> 00:10:09,441
ACCORDING TO SOUFAN'S FBI
REPORT, INCLUDING INTRICATE
DETAILS ABOUT AL QAEDA'S
367
00:10:09,443 --> 00:10:16,948
REPORT, INCLUDING INTRICATE
DETAILS ABOUT AL QAEDA'S
"TRAINING FACILITIES,"
368
00:10:16,950 --> 00:10:17,582
DETAILS ABOUT AL QAEDA'S
"TRAINING FACILITIES,"
"COMMUNICATIONS" AND "WEAPONRY."
369
00:10:17,584 --> 00:10:18,216
"TRAINING FACILITIES,"
"COMMUNICATIONS" AND "WEAPONRY."
IT WAS QUITE AN ACHIEVEMENT FOR
370
00:10:18,218 --> 00:10:18,750
"COMMUNICATIONS" AND "WEAPONRY."
IT WAS QUITE AN ACHIEVEMENT FOR
SOMEONE WHO MIGHT BEST BE
371
00:10:18,752 --> 00:10:19,351
IT WAS QUITE AN ACHIEVEMENT FOR
SOMEONE WHO MIGHT BEST BE
DESCRIBED AS AN ACCIDENTAL FBI
372
00:10:19,353 --> 00:10:20,151
SOMEONE WHO MIGHT BEST BE
DESCRIBED AS AN ACCIDENTAL FBI
AGENT.
373
00:10:20,153 --> 00:10:21,553
DESCRIBED AS AN ACCIDENTAL FBI
AGENT.
SOUFAN GREW UP IN LEBANON DURING
374
00:10:21,555 --> 00:10:24,556
AGENT.
SOUFAN GREW UP IN LEBANON DURING
THAT COUNTRY'S BRUTAL CIVIL WAR,
375
00:10:24,558 --> 00:10:25,924
SOUFAN GREW UP IN LEBANON DURING
THAT COUNTRY'S BRUTAL CIVIL WAR,
AND HE MOVED WITH HIS FAMILY TO
376
00:10:25,926 --> 00:10:29,027
THAT COUNTRY'S BRUTAL CIVIL WAR,
AND HE MOVED WITH HIS FAMILY TO
THE U.S. WHEN HE WAS 17.
377
00:10:29,029 --> 00:10:30,195
AND HE MOVED WITH HIS FAMILY TO
THE U.S. WHEN HE WAS 17.
HE WAS A FRAT BOY AT MANSFIELD
378
00:10:30,197 --> 00:10:31,863
THE U.S. WHEN HE WAS 17.
HE WAS A FRAT BOY AT MANSFIELD
UNIVERSITY IN PENNSYLVANIA,
379
00:10:31,865 --> 00:10:34,566
HE WAS A FRAT BOY AT MANSFIELD
UNIVERSITY IN PENNSYLVANIA,
PLANNING A CAREER IN ACADEMIA,
380
00:10:34,568 --> 00:10:35,467
UNIVERSITY IN PENNSYLVANIA,
PLANNING A CAREER IN ACADEMIA,
WHEN A COLLEGE ADMINISTRATOR
381
00:10:35,469 --> 00:10:36,201
PLANNING A CAREER IN ACADEMIA,
WHEN A COLLEGE ADMINISTRATOR
SUGGESTED HE APPLY FOR A JOB
382
00:10:36,203 --> 00:10:38,637
WHEN A COLLEGE ADMINISTRATOR
SUGGESTED HE APPLY FOR A JOB
WITH THE FBI.
383
00:10:38,639 --> 00:10:40,005
SUGGESTED HE APPLY FOR A JOB
WITH THE FBI.
>> Soufan: WHEN HE SAID THAT, I
384
00:10:40,007 --> 00:10:41,272
WITH THE FBI.
>> Soufan: WHEN HE SAID THAT, I
WAS LIKE... AS IF HE WAS TELLING
385
00:10:41,274 --> 00:10:42,040
>> Soufan: WHEN HE SAID THAT, I
WAS LIKE... AS IF HE WAS TELLING
ME, "YOU'RE GOING TO BE, LIKE,
386
00:10:42,042 --> 00:10:43,074
WAS LIKE... AS IF HE WAS TELLING
ME, "YOU'RE GOING TO BE, LIKE,
IN THE CIRCUS, OR YOU'RE GOING
387
00:10:43,076 --> 00:10:44,142
ME, "YOU'RE GOING TO BE, LIKE,
IN THE CIRCUS, OR YOU'RE GOING
TO BE, YOU KNOW, A RACECAR
388
00:10:44,144 --> 00:10:45,443
IN THE CIRCUS, OR YOU'RE GOING
TO BE, YOU KNOW, A RACECAR
DRIVER."
389
00:10:45,445 --> 00:10:46,478
TO BE, YOU KNOW, A RACECAR
DRIVER."
I MEAN, "FBI?
390
00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:47,479
DRIVER."
I MEAN, "FBI?
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT," YOU
391
00:10:47,481 --> 00:10:47,679
I MEAN, "FBI?
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT," YOU
KNOW?
392
00:10:47,681 --> 00:10:49,881
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT," YOU
KNOW?
PEOPLE WERE LAUGHING.
393
00:10:49,883 --> 00:10:50,515
KNOW?
PEOPLE WERE LAUGHING.
MY FRIENDS...
394
00:10:50,517 --> 00:10:51,816
PEOPLE WERE LAUGHING.
MY FRIENDS...
>> Logan: YOUR FRAT BROTHERS.
395
00:10:51,818 --> 00:10:52,484
MY FRIENDS...
>> Logan: YOUR FRAT BROTHERS.
>> Soufan: YEAH, WERE LAUGHING.
396
00:10:52,486 --> 00:10:53,585
>> Logan: YOUR FRAT BROTHERS.
>> Soufan: YEAH, WERE LAUGHING.
I'M LIKE, "THEY WILL SEND YOU
397
00:10:53,587 --> 00:10:54,853
>> Soufan: YEAH, WERE LAUGHING.
I'M LIKE, "THEY WILL SEND YOU
BACK THE APPLICATION."
398
00:10:54,855 --> 00:10:55,420
I'M LIKE, "THEY WILL SEND YOU
BACK THE APPLICATION."
>> Logan: A LITTLE BIT OF A
399
00:10:55,422 --> 00:10:57,555
BACK THE APPLICATION."
>> Logan: A LITTLE BIT OF A
CHALLENGE.
400
00:10:57,557 --> 00:10:59,024
>> Logan: A LITTLE BIT OF A
CHALLENGE.
>> Soufan: I WAS LIKE, "OKAY.
401
00:10:59,026 --> 00:11:01,192
CHALLENGE.
>> Soufan: I WAS LIKE, "OKAY.
WE'LL SEE ABOUT THAT."
402
00:11:01,194 --> 00:11:02,060
>> Soufan: I WAS LIKE, "OKAY.
WE'LL SEE ABOUT THAT."
>> Logan: IN 1997, AFTER GETTING
403
00:11:02,062 --> 00:11:03,828
WE'LL SEE ABOUT THAT."
>> Logan: IN 1997, AFTER GETTING
A MASTER'S DEGREE IN
404
00:11:03,830 --> 00:11:05,330
>> Logan: IN 1997, AFTER GETTING
A MASTER'S DEGREE IN
INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS, HE
405
00:11:05,332 --> 00:11:06,965
A MASTER'S DEGREE IN
INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS, HE
JOINED THE FBI'S NEW YORK OFFICE
406
00:11:06,967 --> 00:11:09,200
INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS, HE
JOINED THE FBI'S NEW YORK OFFICE
AS A ROOKIE COUNTER-TERRORISM
407
00:11:09,202 --> 00:11:10,969
JOINED THE FBI'S NEW YORK OFFICE
AS A ROOKIE COUNTER-TERRORISM
AGENT, AND HE WAS LITTLE MORE
408
00:11:10,971 --> 00:11:12,170
AS A ROOKIE COUNTER-TERRORISM
AGENT, AND HE WAS LITTLE MORE
THAN THREE YEARS ON THE JOB WHEN
409
00:11:12,172 --> 00:11:15,240
AGENT, AND HE WAS LITTLE MORE
THAN THREE YEARS ON THE JOB WHEN
HE WAS MADE THE CASE AGENT FOR
410
00:11:15,242 --> 00:11:16,241
THAN THREE YEARS ON THE JOB WHEN
HE WAS MADE THE CASE AGENT FOR
THE FBI'S INVESTIGATION OF THE
411
00:11:16,243 --> 00:11:20,011
HE WAS MADE THE CASE AGENT FOR
THE FBI'S INVESTIGATION OF THE
ATTACK ON THE U.S.S. "COLE."
412
00:11:20,013 --> 00:11:22,013
THE FBI'S INVESTIGATION OF THE
ATTACK ON THE U.S.S. "COLE."
IN MARCH 2002, THE U.S. CAPTURED
413
00:11:22,015 --> 00:11:25,684
ATTACK ON THE U.S.S. "COLE."
IN MARCH 2002, THE U.S. CAPTURED
ITS FIRST HIGH-VALUE TERRORIST
414
00:11:25,686 --> 00:11:26,384
IN MARCH 2002, THE U.S. CAPTURED
ITS FIRST HIGH-VALUE TERRORIST
OPERATIVE, ABU ZUBAYDAH, AFTER A
415
00:11:26,386 --> 00:11:30,355
ITS FIRST HIGH-VALUE TERRORIST
OPERATIVE, ABU ZUBAYDAH, AFTER A
FIRE-FIGHT IN PAKISTAN.
416
00:11:30,357 --> 00:11:31,623
OPERATIVE, ABU ZUBAYDAH, AFTER A
FIRE-FIGHT IN PAKISTAN.
ALI SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER WERE
417
00:11:31,625 --> 00:11:32,891
FIRE-FIGHT IN PAKISTAN.
ALI SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER WERE
CALLED IN TO ASSIST IN THE CIA
418
00:11:32,893 --> 00:11:34,592
ALI SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER WERE
CALLED IN TO ASSIST IN THE CIA
INTERROGATION AT A SECRET
419
00:11:34,594 --> 00:11:36,494
CALLED IN TO ASSIST IN THE CIA
INTERROGATION AT A SECRET
LOCATION IN THAILAND.
420
00:11:36,496 --> 00:11:37,228
INTERROGATION AT A SECRET
LOCATION IN THAILAND.
ABU ZUBAYDAH WAS SEVERELY
421
00:11:37,230 --> 00:11:37,796
LOCATION IN THAILAND.
ABU ZUBAYDAH WAS SEVERELY
WOUNDED BUT STILL ABLE TO
422
00:11:37,798 --> 00:11:39,364
ABU ZUBAYDAH WAS SEVERELY
WOUNDED BUT STILL ABLE TO
COMMUNICATE.
423
00:11:39,366 --> 00:11:41,733
WOUNDED BUT STILL ABLE TO
COMMUNICATE.
FROM U.S. INTELLIGENCE FILES,
424
00:11:41,735 --> 00:11:43,201
COMMUNICATE.
FROM U.S. INTELLIGENCE FILES,
SOUFAN HAD LEARNED A LOT ABOUT
425
00:11:43,203 --> 00:11:44,669
FROM U.S. INTELLIGENCE FILES,
SOUFAN HAD LEARNED A LOT ABOUT
ABU ZUBAYDAH, AND HE TOLD US HE
426
00:11:44,671 --> 00:11:45,637
SOUFAN HAD LEARNED A LOT ABOUT
ABU ZUBAYDAH, AND HE TOLD US HE
PUT THAT KNOWLEDGE TO GOOD USE
427
00:11:45,639 --> 00:11:48,773
ABU ZUBAYDAH, AND HE TOLD US HE
PUT THAT KNOWLEDGE TO GOOD USE
RIGHT WAY.
428
00:11:48,775 --> 00:11:50,208
PUT THAT KNOWLEDGE TO GOOD USE
RIGHT WAY.
>> Soufan: WHEN I FIRST MET HIM,
429
00:11:50,210 --> 00:11:52,744
RIGHT WAY.
>> Soufan: WHEN I FIRST MET HIM,
I ASKED HIM HIS NAME, AND HE
430
00:11:52,746 --> 00:11:54,245
>> Soufan: WHEN I FIRST MET HIM,
I ASKED HIM HIS NAME, AND HE
GAVE ME A FAKE NAME.
431
00:11:54,247 --> 00:11:54,779
I ASKED HIM HIS NAME, AND HE
GAVE ME A FAKE NAME.
>> Logan: "DAWUD."
432
00:11:54,781 --> 00:11:55,380
GAVE ME A FAKE NAME.
>> Logan: "DAWUD."
>> Soufan: A DIFFERENT NAME--
433
00:11:55,382 --> 00:11:58,917
>> Logan: "DAWUD."
>> Soufan: A DIFFERENT NAME--
"DAWUD."
434
00:11:58,919 --> 00:11:59,517
>> Soufan: A DIFFERENT NAME--
"DAWUD."
AND I SAID TO HIM, "WHAT IF I
435
00:11:59,519 --> 00:12:02,020
"DAWUD."
AND I SAID TO HIM, "WHAT IF I
CALL YOU 'HANI'?"
436
00:12:02,022 --> 00:12:02,587
AND I SAID TO HIM, "WHAT IF I
CALL YOU 'HANI'?"
AND THE LOOK ON HIS FACE WAS
437
00:12:02,589 --> 00:12:02,987
CALL YOU 'HANI'?"
AND THE LOOK ON HIS FACE WAS
LIKE...
438
00:12:02,989 --> 00:12:04,823
AND THE LOOK ON HIS FACE WAS
LIKE...
YOU KNOW?
439
00:12:04,825 --> 00:12:05,724
LIKE...
YOU KNOW?
LIKE... YOU KNOW, LIKE, YOU
440
00:12:05,726 --> 00:12:06,291
YOU KNOW?
LIKE... YOU KNOW, LIKE, YOU
KNOW, "THAT'S IT.
441
00:12:06,293 --> 00:12:08,626
LIKE... YOU KNOW, LIKE, YOU
KNOW, "THAT'S IT.
IT'S OVER."
442
00:12:08,628 --> 00:12:10,729
KNOW, "THAT'S IT.
IT'S OVER."
AND HE JUST LOOKED AT ME AND
443
00:12:10,731 --> 00:12:12,230
IT'S OVER."
AND HE JUST LOOKED AT ME AND
HE... JUST SHOOK HIS HEAD.
444
00:12:12,232 --> 00:12:13,631
AND HE JUST LOOKED AT ME AND
HE... JUST SHOOK HIS HEAD.
HE WAS SHOCKED.
445
00:12:13,633 --> 00:12:16,668
HE... JUST SHOOK HIS HEAD.
HE WAS SHOCKED.
"HANI" IS THE NAME THAT HIS
446
00:12:16,670 --> 00:12:17,936
HE WAS SHOCKED.
"HANI" IS THE NAME THAT HIS
MOTHER CALLED HIM AS A CHILD.
447
00:12:17,938 --> 00:12:19,037
"HANI" IS THE NAME THAT HIS
MOTHER CALLED HIM AS A CHILD.
SO HE KNEW THAT I KNOW
448
00:12:19,039 --> 00:12:19,971
MOTHER CALLED HIM AS A CHILD.
SO HE KNEW THAT I KNOW
EVERYTHING ABOUT HIM.
449
00:12:19,973 --> 00:12:20,605
SO HE KNEW THAT I KNOW
EVERYTHING ABOUT HIM.
>> Logan: WHY DO YOU THINK THAT
450
00:12:20,607 --> 00:12:22,307
EVERYTHING ABOUT HIM.
>> Logan: WHY DO YOU THINK THAT
MATTERED SO MUCH?
451
00:12:22,309 --> 00:12:25,944
>> Logan: WHY DO YOU THINK THAT
MATTERED SO MUCH?
>> Soufan: IT KIND OF TOLD HIM
452
00:12:25,946 --> 00:12:26,578
MATTERED SO MUCH?
>> Soufan: IT KIND OF TOLD HIM
THAT YOU CANNOT PLAY GAMES WITH
453
00:12:26,580 --> 00:12:27,145
>> Soufan: IT KIND OF TOLD HIM
THAT YOU CANNOT PLAY GAMES WITH
US.
454
00:12:27,147 --> 00:12:28,546
THAT YOU CANNOT PLAY GAMES WITH
US.
WE KNOW WHO YOU ARE.
455
00:12:28,548 --> 00:12:29,247
US.
WE KNOW WHO YOU ARE.
>> Logan: AND WHAT DO YOU THINK
456
00:12:29,249 --> 00:12:29,981
WE KNOW WHO YOU ARE.
>> Logan: AND WHAT DO YOU THINK
IS THE MOST IMPORTANT
457
00:12:29,983 --> 00:12:30,548
>> Logan: AND WHAT DO YOU THINK
IS THE MOST IMPORTANT
INFORMATION THAT CAME OUT OF
458
00:12:30,550 --> 00:12:31,683
IS THE MOST IMPORTANT
INFORMATION THAT CAME OUT OF
THAT?
459
00:12:31,685 --> 00:12:32,917
INFORMATION THAT CAME OUT OF
THAT?
>> Soufan: THE MOST IMPORTANT
460
00:12:32,919 --> 00:12:34,085
THAT?
>> Soufan: THE MOST IMPORTANT
INFORMATION IS IDENTIFYING
461
00:12:34,087 --> 00:12:35,954
>> Soufan: THE MOST IMPORTANT
INFORMATION IS IDENTIFYING
KHALID SHEIKH MOHAMMED AS A
462
00:12:35,956 --> 00:12:40,191
INFORMATION IS IDENTIFYING
KHALID SHEIKH MOHAMMED AS A
MASTERMIND OF 9/11.
463
00:12:40,193 --> 00:12:40,892
KHALID SHEIKH MOHAMMED AS A
MASTERMIND OF 9/11.
>> Logan: AT THE TIME, KHALID
464
00:12:40,894 --> 00:12:41,826
MASTERMIND OF 9/11.
>> Logan: AT THE TIME, KHALID
SHEIKH MOHAMMED, OR "KSM", WAS
465
00:12:41,828 --> 00:12:42,994
>> Logan: AT THE TIME, KHALID
SHEIKH MOHAMMED, OR "KSM", WAS
ON THE FBI'S MOST WANTED LIST
466
00:12:42,996 --> 00:12:47,132
SHEIKH MOHAMMED, OR "KSM", WAS
ON THE FBI'S MOST WANTED LIST
FOR OTHER TERRORIST PLOTS.
467
00:12:47,134 --> 00:12:49,467
ON THE FBI'S MOST WANTED LIST
FOR OTHER TERRORIST PLOTS.
U.S. INTELLIGENCE SUSPECTED HE
468
00:12:49,469 --> 00:12:50,702
FOR OTHER TERRORIST PLOTS.
U.S. INTELLIGENCE SUSPECTED HE
WAS INVOLVED IN 9/11, BUT THE
469
00:12:50,704 --> 00:12:52,904
U.S. INTELLIGENCE SUSPECTED HE
WAS INVOLVED IN 9/11, BUT THE
FBI DIDN'T HAVE ANY EVIDENCE OF
470
00:12:52,906 --> 00:12:54,873
WAS INVOLVED IN 9/11, BUT THE
FBI DIDN'T HAVE ANY EVIDENCE OF
THAT.
471
00:12:54,875 --> 00:12:56,541
FBI DIDN'T HAVE ANY EVIDENCE OF
THAT.
ALI SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER,
472
00:12:56,543 --> 00:12:57,509
THAT.
ALI SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER,
STEVE GAUDIN, MEANT TO SHOW ABU
473
00:12:57,511 --> 00:12:59,077
ALI SOUFAN AND HIS PARTNER,
STEVE GAUDIN, MEANT TO SHOW ABU
ZUBAYDAH A PHOTO OF SOMEONE ELSE
474
00:12:59,079 --> 00:13:00,845
STEVE GAUDIN, MEANT TO SHOW ABU
ZUBAYDAH A PHOTO OF SOMEONE ELSE
ON THE MOST WANTED LIST, BUT
475
00:13:00,847 --> 00:13:04,382
ZUBAYDAH A PHOTO OF SOMEONE ELSE
ON THE MOST WANTED LIST, BUT
THEY SHOWED ABU ZUBAYDAH THIS
476
00:13:04,384 --> 00:13:05,216
ON THE MOST WANTED LIST, BUT
THEY SHOWED ABU ZUBAYDAH THIS
PHOTO OF K.S.M. BY MISTAKE.
477
00:13:05,218 --> 00:13:05,917
THEY SHOWED ABU ZUBAYDAH THIS
PHOTO OF K.S.M. BY MISTAKE.
>> Soufan: HE LOOKS AT ME AND HE
478
00:13:05,919 --> 00:13:06,584
PHOTO OF K.S.M. BY MISTAKE.
>> Soufan: HE LOOKS AT ME AND HE
SAYS, "DON'T PLAY GAMES WITH ME,
479
00:13:06,586 --> 00:13:07,152
>> Soufan: HE LOOKS AT ME AND HE
SAYS, "DON'T PLAY GAMES WITH ME,
BROTHER.
480
00:13:07,154 --> 00:13:08,052
SAYS, "DON'T PLAY GAMES WITH ME,
BROTHER.
DON'T PLAY GAMES WITH ME.
481
00:13:08,054 --> 00:13:11,289
BROTHER.
DON'T PLAY GAMES WITH ME.
YOU KNOW WHO THIS GUY.
482
00:13:11,291 --> 00:13:12,824
DON'T PLAY GAMES WITH ME.
YOU KNOW WHO THIS GUY.
THIS IS... THIS IS MUKHTAR.
483
00:13:12,826 --> 00:13:14,125
YOU KNOW WHO THIS GUY.
THIS IS... THIS IS MUKHTAR.
THIS IS MASTERMIND OF THE PLANE
484
00:13:14,127 --> 00:13:15,326
THIS IS... THIS IS MUKHTAR.
THIS IS MASTERMIND OF THE PLANE
OPERATIONS."
485
00:13:15,328 --> 00:13:16,761
THIS IS MASTERMIND OF THE PLANE
OPERATIONS."
>> Logan: OF 9/11?
486
00:13:16,763 --> 00:13:18,963
OPERATIONS."
>> Logan: OF 9/11?
>> Soufan: THAT'S WHAT AL QAEDA
487
00:13:18,965 --> 00:13:19,597
>> Logan: OF 9/11?
>> Soufan: THAT'S WHAT AL QAEDA
CALL 9/11, "THE PLANE
488
00:13:19,599 --> 00:13:20,632
>> Soufan: THAT'S WHAT AL QAEDA
CALL 9/11, "THE PLANE
OPERATIONS."
489
00:13:20,634 --> 00:13:21,499
CALL 9/11, "THE PLANE
OPERATIONS."
>> Logan: MUKHTAR?
490
00:13:21,501 --> 00:13:21,800
OPERATIONS."
>> Logan: MUKHTAR?
THAT'S...
491
00:13:21,802 --> 00:13:22,467
>> Logan: MUKHTAR?
THAT'S...
>> Soufan: MUKHTAR.
492
00:13:22,469 --> 00:13:23,067
THAT'S...
>> Soufan: MUKHTAR.
>> Logan: ...THE NAME HE USES?
493
00:13:23,069 --> 00:13:23,668
>> Soufan: MUKHTAR.
>> Logan: ...THE NAME HE USES?
>> Soufan: THAT WAS THE ALIAS
494
00:13:23,670 --> 00:13:24,536
>> Logan: ...THE NAME HE USES?
>> Soufan: THAT WAS THE ALIAS
FOR KSM.
495
00:13:24,538 --> 00:13:26,337
>> Soufan: THAT WAS THE ALIAS
FOR KSM.
>> Logan: DID YOU KNOW THAT?
496
00:13:26,339 --> 00:13:27,705
FOR KSM.
>> Logan: DID YOU KNOW THAT?
>> Soufan: NO.
497
00:13:27,707 --> 00:13:28,239
>> Logan: DID YOU KNOW THAT?
>> Soufan: NO.
I HAD NO IDEA.
498
00:13:28,241 --> 00:13:29,240
>> Soufan: NO.
I HAD NO IDEA.
THE ONLY THING I KNEW AT THE
499
00:13:29,242 --> 00:13:29,841
I HAD NO IDEA.
THE ONLY THING I KNEW AT THE
TIME, I'M LOOKING FOR A
500
00:13:29,843 --> 00:13:30,875
THE ONLY THING I KNEW AT THE
TIME, I'M LOOKING FOR A
"MUKHTAR."
501
00:13:30,877 --> 00:13:32,043
TIME, I'M LOOKING FOR A
"MUKHTAR."
SO, WHEN HE SAID "MUKHTAR," IT
502
00:13:32,045 --> 00:13:35,547
"MUKHTAR."
SO, WHEN HE SAID "MUKHTAR," IT
KIND OF, LIKE, CLICKED.
503
00:13:35,549 --> 00:13:36,714
SO, WHEN HE SAID "MUKHTAR," IT
KIND OF, LIKE, CLICKED.
SO I LOOKED AT IT AND I SAID,
504
00:13:36,716 --> 00:13:37,282
KIND OF, LIKE, CLICKED.
SO I LOOKED AT IT AND I SAID,
"OH, STEVE, YOU GAVE ME THE
505
00:13:37,284 --> 00:13:38,983
SO I LOOKED AT IT AND I SAID,
"OH, STEVE, YOU GAVE ME THE
WRONG PHOTO."
506
00:13:38,985 --> 00:13:41,386
"OH, STEVE, YOU GAVE ME THE
WRONG PHOTO."
AND I GAVE IT TO STEVE, SO HE
507
00:13:41,388 --> 00:13:42,253
WRONG PHOTO."
AND I GAVE IT TO STEVE, SO HE
WILL KNOW WHO THE MASTERMIND OF
508
00:13:42,255 --> 00:13:44,589
AND I GAVE IT TO STEVE, SO HE
WILL KNOW WHO THE MASTERMIND OF
9/11 IS.
509
00:13:44,591 --> 00:13:45,223
WILL KNOW WHO THE MASTERMIND OF
9/11 IS.
>> Logan: YOU'RE PLAYING IT VERY
510
00:13:45,225 --> 00:13:45,824
9/11 IS.
>> Logan: YOU'RE PLAYING IT VERY
COOL, BUT WHAT'S GOING THROUGH
511
00:13:45,826 --> 00:13:47,559
>> Logan: YOU'RE PLAYING IT VERY
COOL, BUT WHAT'S GOING THROUGH
YOUR HEAD, REALLY?
512
00:13:47,561 --> 00:13:50,728
COOL, BUT WHAT'S GOING THROUGH
YOUR HEAD, REALLY?
>> Soufan: "HOLY ( BLEEP )!
513
00:13:50,730 --> 00:13:52,831
YOUR HEAD, REALLY?
>> Soufan: "HOLY ( BLEEP )!
K.S.M. IS AN AL QAEDA GUY, THE
514
00:13:52,833 --> 00:13:54,232
>> Soufan: "HOLY ( BLEEP )!
K.S.M. IS AN AL QAEDA GUY, THE
ONE IN 9/11?"
515
00:13:54,234 --> 00:13:55,266
K.S.M. IS AN AL QAEDA GUY, THE
ONE IN 9/11?"
>> Logan: IT WAS AN ACCIDENT?
516
00:13:55,268 --> 00:13:55,733
ONE IN 9/11?"
>> Logan: IT WAS AN ACCIDENT?
>> Soufan: TOTALLY.
517
00:13:55,735 --> 00:13:57,836
>> Logan: IT WAS AN ACCIDENT?
>> Soufan: TOTALLY.
TOTALLY.
518
00:13:57,838 --> 00:13:59,671
>> Soufan: TOTALLY.
TOTALLY.
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS HE
519
00:13:59,673 --> 00:14:00,405
TOTALLY.
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS HE
BELIEVES ABU ZUBAYDAH DIDN'T
520
00:14:00,407 --> 00:14:01,539
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS HE
BELIEVES ABU ZUBAYDAH DIDN'T
MEAN TO DIVULGE IMPORTANT
521
00:14:01,541 --> 00:14:03,675
BELIEVES ABU ZUBAYDAH DIDN'T
MEAN TO DIVULGE IMPORTANT
INFORMATION, AND WAS TRYING TO
522
00:14:03,677 --> 00:14:09,714
MEAN TO DIVULGE IMPORTANT
INFORMATION, AND WAS TRYING TO
GIVE UP AS LITTLE AS POSSIBLE.
523
00:14:09,716 --> 00:14:10,982
INFORMATION, AND WAS TRYING TO
GIVE UP AS LITTLE AS POSSIBLE.
WAS HE WELL VERSED IN
524
00:14:10,984 --> 00:14:11,449
GIVE UP AS LITTLE AS POSSIBLE.
WAS HE WELL VERSED IN
>> Logan: ...COUNTER-
525
00:14:11,451 --> 00:14:11,850
WAS HE WELL VERSED IN
>> Logan: ...COUNTER-
INTELLIGENCE?
526
00:14:11,852 --> 00:14:12,250
>> Logan: ...COUNTER-
INTELLIGENCE?
>> Soufan: YES.
527
00:14:12,252 --> 00:14:13,585
INTELLIGENCE?
>> Soufan: YES.
HE'S... HE'S DEFINITELY WELL
528
00:14:13,587 --> 00:14:14,219
>> Soufan: YES.
HE'S... HE'S DEFINITELY WELL
VERSED IN COUNTER-INTELLIGENCE.
529
00:14:14,221 --> 00:14:16,187
HE'S... HE'S DEFINITELY WELL
VERSED IN COUNTER-INTELLIGENCE.
COUNTER-INTERROGATION.
530
00:14:16,189 --> 00:14:23,595
VERSED IN COUNTER-INTELLIGENCE.
COUNTER-INTERROGATION.
HE IS A SMART... HE IS, I CAN
531
00:14:23,597 --> 00:14:25,697
COUNTER-INTERROGATION.
HE IS A SMART... HE IS, I CAN
ACTUALLY SAY, BORDERLINE GENIUS.
532
00:14:25,699 --> 00:14:26,364
HE IS A SMART... HE IS, I CAN
ACTUALLY SAY, BORDERLINE GENIUS.
YOU KNOW, I... I HEAR A LOT OF
533
00:14:26,366 --> 00:14:26,998
ACTUALLY SAY, BORDERLINE GENIUS.
YOU KNOW, I... I HEAR A LOT OF
PEOPLE SAYING HE'S AN IDIOT.
534
00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,234
YOU KNOW, I... I HEAR A LOT OF
PEOPLE SAYING HE'S AN IDIOT.
HE'S... NO, HE'S... HE'S
535
00:14:29,236 --> 00:14:29,834
PEOPLE SAYING HE'S AN IDIOT.
HE'S... NO, HE'S... HE'S
PROBABLY ONE OF THE SMARTEST
536
00:14:29,836 --> 00:14:31,069
HE'S... NO, HE'S... HE'S
PROBABLY ONE OF THE SMARTEST
PEOPLE I INTERROGATED.
537
00:14:31,071 --> 00:14:31,970
PROBABLY ONE OF THE SMARTEST
PEOPLE I INTERROGATED.
>> Logan: SOUFAN THOUGHT HE AND
538
00:14:31,972 --> 00:14:34,505
PEOPLE I INTERROGATED.
>> Logan: SOUFAN THOUGHT HE AND
HIS PARTNER WERE MAKING
539
00:14:34,507 --> 00:14:35,773
>> Logan: SOUFAN THOUGHT HE AND
HIS PARTNER WERE MAKING
PROGRESS, BUT HE SAYS EVERYTHING
540
00:14:35,775 --> 00:14:37,375
HIS PARTNER WERE MAKING
PROGRESS, BUT HE SAYS EVERYTHING
ABRUPTLY CHANGED AFTER TEN DAYS
541
00:14:37,377 --> 00:14:39,344
PROGRESS, BUT HE SAYS EVERYTHING
ABRUPTLY CHANGED AFTER TEN DAYS
WHEN HE WAS TOLD TO STOP TALKING
542
00:14:39,346 --> 00:14:40,578
ABRUPTLY CHANGED AFTER TEN DAYS
WHEN HE WAS TOLD TO STOP TALKING
TO ABU ZUBAYDAH.
543
00:14:40,580 --> 00:14:42,180
WHEN HE WAS TOLD TO STOP TALKING
TO ABU ZUBAYDAH.
>> Soufan: THE C.T.C. TEAM, THE
544
00:14:42,182 --> 00:14:43,314
TO ABU ZUBAYDAH.
>> Soufan: THE C.T.C. TEAM, THE
COUNTER-TERRORISM CENTER TEAM,
545
00:14:43,316 --> 00:14:44,582
>> Soufan: THE C.T.C. TEAM, THE
COUNTER-TERRORISM CENTER TEAM,
ARRIVED.
546
00:14:44,584 --> 00:14:45,516
COUNTER-TERRORISM CENTER TEAM,
ARRIVED.
>> Logan: OF THE CIA.
547
00:14:45,518 --> 00:14:47,085
ARRIVED.
>> Logan: OF THE CIA.
>> Soufan: OF THE CIA.
548
00:14:47,087 --> 00:14:48,386
>> Logan: OF THE CIA.
>> Soufan: OF THE CIA.
SO WE TOLD THEM, FROM OUR
549
00:14:48,388 --> 00:14:49,921
>> Soufan: OF THE CIA.
SO WE TOLD THEM, FROM OUR
PERSPECTIVE, THAT HE HAS BEEN
550
00:14:49,923 --> 00:14:55,293
SO WE TOLD THEM, FROM OUR
PERSPECTIVE, THAT HE HAS BEEN
COOPERATING.
551
00:14:55,328 --> 00:14:55,860
PERSPECTIVE, THAT HE HAS BEEN
COOPERATING.
WE JUST GOT INFORMATION THAT
552
00:14:55,862 --> 00:14:56,427
COOPERATING.
WE JUST GOT INFORMATION THAT
K.S.M. IS THE MASTERMIND OF
553
00:14:56,429 --> 00:14:59,664
WE JUST GOT INFORMATION THAT
K.S.M. IS THE MASTERMIND OF
9/11.
554
00:14:59,666 --> 00:15:01,966
K.S.M. IS THE MASTERMIND OF
9/11.
THEY SAID, "WELL, YEAH, BUT
555
00:15:01,968 --> 00:15:04,068
9/11.
THEY SAID, "WELL, YEAH, BUT
THERE'S A BELIEF THAT THERE'S A
556
00:15:04,070 --> 00:15:05,937
THEY SAID, "WELL, YEAH, BUT
THERE'S A BELIEF THAT THERE'S A
LOT MORE INFORMATION, AND HE'S
557
00:15:05,939 --> 00:15:09,774
THERE'S A BELIEF THAT THERE'S A
LOT MORE INFORMATION, AND HE'S
NOT GIVING IT UP YET."
558
00:15:09,776 --> 00:15:12,143
LOT MORE INFORMATION, AND HE'S
NOT GIVING IT UP YET."
SO IT ENDED UP THAT THERE'S A
559
00:15:12,145 --> 00:15:13,444
NOT GIVING IT UP YET."
SO IT ENDED UP THAT THERE'S A
PLAN ALREADY DECIDED IN
560
00:15:13,446 --> 00:15:14,979
SO IT ENDED UP THAT THERE'S A
PLAN ALREADY DECIDED IN
WASHINGTON THAT WAS BASICALLY TO
561
00:15:14,981 --> 00:15:17,515
PLAN ALREADY DECIDED IN
WASHINGTON THAT WAS BASICALLY TO
STRATEGICALLY DIMINISH HIS
562
00:15:17,517 --> 00:15:20,285
WASHINGTON THAT WAS BASICALLY TO
STRATEGICALLY DIMINISH HIS
"ABILITY TO RESIST," AS... AS
563
00:15:20,287 --> 00:15:22,687
STRATEGICALLY DIMINISH HIS
"ABILITY TO RESIST," AS... AS
THE TERM WAS USED.
564
00:15:22,689 --> 00:15:27,058
"ABILITY TO RESIST," AS... AS
THE TERM WAS USED.
WE KNEW THAT WE'RE GOING DOWN ON
565
00:15:27,060 --> 00:15:28,092
THE TERM WAS USED.
WE KNEW THAT WE'RE GOING DOWN ON
A PATH THAT'S A DANGEROUS PATH,
566
00:15:28,094 --> 00:15:28,693
WE KNEW THAT WE'RE GOING DOWN ON
A PATH THAT'S A DANGEROUS PATH,
A PATH THAT WE HAVEN'T BEEN ON
567
00:15:28,695 --> 00:15:30,461
A PATH THAT'S A DANGEROUS PATH,
A PATH THAT WE HAVEN'T BEEN ON
BEFORE.
568
00:15:30,463 --> 00:15:31,629
A PATH THAT WE HAVEN'T BEEN ON
BEFORE.
SO WE HAD TO PULL OUT FROM THE
569
00:15:31,631 --> 00:15:34,198
BEFORE.
SO WE HAD TO PULL OUT FROM THE
INTERROGATION, AND WE HAD TO
570
00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:40,605
SO WE HAD TO PULL OUT FROM THE
INTERROGATION, AND WE HAD TO
START WITNESSING SOMETHING THAT
571
00:15:40,607 --> 00:15:41,673
INTERROGATION, AND WE HAD TO
START WITNESSING SOMETHING THAT
WAS REALLY SURPRISING, SOME
572
00:15:41,675 --> 00:15:44,242
START WITNESSING SOMETHING THAT
WAS REALLY SURPRISING, SOME
TECHNIQUE THAT WE NEVER THOUGHT
573
00:15:44,244 --> 00:15:46,911
WAS REALLY SURPRISING, SOME
TECHNIQUE THAT WE NEVER THOUGHT
THAT WE WILL SEE US DOING.
574
00:15:46,913 --> 00:15:49,347
TECHNIQUE THAT WE NEVER THOUGHT
THAT WE WILL SEE US DOING.
>> Logan: THE NEW TECHNIQUES ALI
575
00:15:49,349 --> 00:15:51,549
THAT WE WILL SEE US DOING.
>> Logan: THE NEW TECHNIQUES ALI
SOUFAN IS TALKING ABOUT INCLUDED
576
00:15:51,551 --> 00:15:52,183
>> Logan: THE NEW TECHNIQUES ALI
SOUFAN IS TALKING ABOUT INCLUDED
NUDITY, SLEEP-DEPRIVATION, AND
577
00:15:52,185 --> 00:15:53,952
SOUFAN IS TALKING ABOUT INCLUDED
NUDITY, SLEEP-DEPRIVATION, AND
LOUD MUSIC.
578
00:15:53,954 --> 00:15:55,420
NUDITY, SLEEP-DEPRIVATION, AND
LOUD MUSIC.
IT WAS THE BEGINNING OF THE
579
00:15:55,422 --> 00:15:57,188
LOUD MUSIC.
IT WAS THE BEGINNING OF THE
TOUGH AND CONTROVERSIAL METHODS
580
00:15:57,190 --> 00:15:58,823
IT WAS THE BEGINNING OF THE
TOUGH AND CONTROVERSIAL METHODS
THAT WOULD ULTIMATELY INCLUDE
581
00:15:58,825 --> 00:16:00,525
TOUGH AND CONTROVERSIAL METHODS
THAT WOULD ULTIMATELY INCLUDE
WATER-BOARDING AND BECOME KNOWN
582
00:16:00,527 --> 00:16:01,426
THAT WOULD ULTIMATELY INCLUDE
WATER-BOARDING AND BECOME KNOWN
AS "ENHANCED INTERROGATION
583
00:16:01,428 --> 00:16:03,594
WATER-BOARDING AND BECOME KNOWN
AS "ENHANCED INTERROGATION
TECHNIQUES."
584
00:16:03,596 --> 00:16:05,363
AS "ENHANCED INTERROGATION
TECHNIQUES."
WHAT ALI SOUFAN WITNESSED, AND
585
00:16:05,365 --> 00:16:06,698
TECHNIQUES."
WHAT ALI SOUFAN WITNESSED, AND
WHAT HE DID ABOUT IT, WHEN WE
586
00:16:06,700 --> 00:16:09,000
WHAT ALI SOUFAN WITNESSED, AND
WHAT HE DID ABOUT IT, WHEN WE
COME BACK.
587
00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:19,544
>> Logan: THE USE OF WATER-
BOARDING AND OTHER TOUGH NEW
METHODS KNOWN AS "ENHANCED
588
00:16:19,546 --> 00:16:21,980
BOARDING AND OTHER TOUGH NEW
METHODS KNOWN AS "ENHANCED
INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES" LED TO
589
00:16:21,982 --> 00:16:24,248
METHODS KNOWN AS "ENHANCED
INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES" LED TO
A VERY PUBLIC DEBATE ABOUT
590
00:16:24,250 --> 00:16:25,216
INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES" LED TO
A VERY PUBLIC DEBATE ABOUT
WHETHER THE U.S. WAS TORTURING
591
00:16:25,218 --> 00:16:27,585
A VERY PUBLIC DEBATE ABOUT
WHETHER THE U.S. WAS TORTURING
TERRORISM SUSPECTS.
592
00:16:27,587 --> 00:16:28,753
WHETHER THE U.S. WAS TORTURING
TERRORISM SUSPECTS.
THE VIDEOTAPES OF THOSE
593
00:16:28,755 --> 00:16:31,622
TERRORISM SUSPECTS.
THE VIDEOTAPES OF THOSE
INTERROGATIONS HAVE REPORTEDLY
594
00:16:31,624 --> 00:16:32,690
THE VIDEOTAPES OF THOSE
INTERROGATIONS HAVE REPORTEDLY
BEEN DESTROYED, AND HARDLY
595
00:16:32,692 --> 00:16:34,192
INTERROGATIONS HAVE REPORTEDLY
BEEN DESTROYED, AND HARDLY
ANYONE WHO PARTICIPATED IN THEM
596
00:16:34,194 --> 00:16:36,494
BEEN DESTROYED, AND HARDLY
ANYONE WHO PARTICIPATED IN THEM
HAS SPOKEN PUBLICLY.
597
00:16:36,496 --> 00:16:38,029
ANYONE WHO PARTICIPATED IN THEM
HAS SPOKEN PUBLICLY.
NOR HAS ENOUGH INFORMATION BEEN
598
00:16:38,031 --> 00:16:42,600
HAS SPOKEN PUBLICLY.
NOR HAS ENOUGH INFORMATION BEEN
MADE PUBLIC TO DETERMINE IF THE
599
00:16:42,602 --> 00:16:43,234
NOR HAS ENOUGH INFORMATION BEEN
MADE PUBLIC TO DETERMINE IF THE
TECHNIQUES WERE SUCCESSFUL.
600
00:16:43,236 --> 00:16:44,469
MADE PUBLIC TO DETERMINE IF THE
TECHNIQUES WERE SUCCESSFUL.
BUT IN APRIL OF 2002, FBI AGENT
601
00:16:44,471 --> 00:16:45,937
TECHNIQUES WERE SUCCESSFUL.
BUT IN APRIL OF 2002, FBI AGENT
ALI SOUFAN WITNESSED THE
602
00:16:45,939 --> 00:16:48,506
BUT IN APRIL OF 2002, FBI AGENT
ALI SOUFAN WITNESSED THE
BEGINNING OF THE USE OF THESE
603
00:16:48,508 --> 00:16:49,574
ALI SOUFAN WITNESSED THE
BEGINNING OF THE USE OF THESE
TECHNIQUES ON THE U.S.'s FIRST
604
00:16:49,576 --> 00:16:51,776
BEGINNING OF THE USE OF THESE
TECHNIQUES ON THE U.S.'s FIRST
HIGH-VALUE TERRORIST DETAINEE,
605
00:16:51,778 --> 00:16:54,212
TECHNIQUES ON THE U.S.'s FIRST
HIGH-VALUE TERRORIST DETAINEE,
ABU ZUBAYDAH.
606
00:16:54,214 --> 00:16:55,646
HIGH-VALUE TERRORIST DETAINEE,
ABU ZUBAYDAH.
SOUFAN SAYS HE WAS MAKING GOOD
607
00:16:55,648 --> 00:16:56,848
ABU ZUBAYDAH.
SOUFAN SAYS HE WAS MAKING GOOD
PROGRESS WITH ABU ZUBAYDAH
608
00:16:56,850 --> 00:16:58,616
SOUFAN SAYS HE WAS MAKING GOOD
PROGRESS WITH ABU ZUBAYDAH
THROUGH TRADITIONAL METHODS OF
609
00:16:58,618 --> 00:16:59,017
PROGRESS WITH ABU ZUBAYDAH
THROUGH TRADITIONAL METHODS OF
QUESTIONING.
610
00:16:59,019 --> 00:17:00,385
THROUGH TRADITIONAL METHODS OF
QUESTIONING.
BUT HE WAS TOLD THAT A CIA
611
00:17:00,387 --> 00:17:01,853
QUESTIONING.
BUT HE WAS TOLD THAT A CIA
CONTRACTOR, HIRED FOR HIS
612
00:17:01,855 --> 00:17:05,390
BUT HE WAS TOLD THAT A CIA
CONTRACTOR, HIRED FOR HIS
INTERROGATION EXPERTISE, WOULD
613
00:17:05,392 --> 00:17:06,491
CONTRACTOR, HIRED FOR HIS
INTERROGATION EXPERTISE, WOULD
BE TAKING CONTROL.
614
00:17:06,493 --> 00:17:08,860
INTERROGATION EXPERTISE, WOULD
BE TAKING CONTROL.
SOUFAN THEN WATCHED ON A CLOSED
615
00:17:08,862 --> 00:17:10,628
BE TAKING CONTROL.
SOUFAN THEN WATCHED ON A CLOSED
CIRCUIT MONITOR AS A VERY
616
00:17:10,630 --> 00:17:14,198
SOUFAN THEN WATCHED ON A CLOSED
CIRCUIT MONITOR AS A VERY
DIFFERENT APPROACH WAS USED.
617
00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:15,466
CIRCUIT MONITOR AS A VERY
DIFFERENT APPROACH WAS USED.
>> Soufan: THE PLAN AT THE TIME
618
00:17:15,468 --> 00:17:18,102
DIFFERENT APPROACH WAS USED.
>> Soufan: THE PLAN AT THE TIME
WAS TO GO IN AND TELL ABU
619
00:17:18,104 --> 00:17:21,239
>> Soufan: THE PLAN AT THE TIME
WAS TO GO IN AND TELL ABU
ZUBAYDAH ONE QUESTION.
620
00:17:21,241 --> 00:17:21,839
WAS TO GO IN AND TELL ABU
ZUBAYDAH ONE QUESTION.
TELL HIM, "TELL ME WHAT I WANT
621
00:17:21,841 --> 00:17:23,307
ZUBAYDAH ONE QUESTION.
TELL HIM, "TELL ME WHAT I WANT
TO KNOW."
622
00:17:23,309 --> 00:17:24,542
TELL HIM, "TELL ME WHAT I WANT
TO KNOW."
AND IF ABU ZUBAYDAH SAID, "WHAT
623
00:17:24,544 --> 00:17:27,412
TO KNOW."
AND IF ABU ZUBAYDAH SAID, "WHAT
DO YOU WANT TO KNOW?" OR ASK ANY
624
00:17:27,414 --> 00:17:28,312
AND IF ABU ZUBAYDAH SAID, "WHAT
DO YOU WANT TO KNOW?" OR ASK ANY
QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT, THE PERSON
625
00:17:28,314 --> 00:17:31,082
DO YOU WANT TO KNOW?" OR ASK ANY
QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT, THE PERSON
IS TO WALK OUT.
626
00:17:31,084 --> 00:17:31,883
QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT, THE PERSON
IS TO WALK OUT.
AND SAY, "YOU KNOW," AND WALK
627
00:17:31,885 --> 00:17:33,217
IS TO WALK OUT.
AND SAY, "YOU KNOW," AND WALK
OUT.
628
00:17:33,219 --> 00:17:36,087
AND SAY, "YOU KNOW," AND WALK
OUT.
AND THEN, THEY HAVE A CONTINUUM
629
00:17:36,089 --> 00:17:37,288
OUT.
AND THEN, THEY HAVE A CONTINUUM
OF TECHNIQUES LIKE... YOU KNOW,
630
00:17:37,290 --> 00:17:38,990
AND THEN, THEY HAVE A CONTINUUM
OF TECHNIQUES LIKE... YOU KNOW,
IT STARTED WITH, LIKE, NUDITY.
631
00:17:38,992 --> 00:17:42,727
OF TECHNIQUES LIKE... YOU KNOW,
IT STARTED WITH, LIKE, NUDITY.
AND THEN, YOU HAVE NOISE AND YOU
632
00:17:42,729 --> 00:17:43,828
IT STARTED WITH, LIKE, NUDITY.
AND THEN, YOU HAVE NOISE AND YOU
HAVE SLEEP DEPRIVATION.
633
00:17:43,830 --> 00:17:44,462
AND THEN, YOU HAVE NOISE AND YOU
HAVE SLEEP DEPRIVATION.
AND IT GOES FROM ONE STAGE TO
634
00:17:44,464 --> 00:17:45,596
HAVE SLEEP DEPRIVATION.
AND IT GOES FROM ONE STAGE TO
ANOTHER, UNTIL HE DECIDES TO
635
00:17:45,598 --> 00:17:46,864
AND IT GOES FROM ONE STAGE TO
ANOTHER, UNTIL HE DECIDES TO
COOPERATE.
636
00:17:46,866 --> 00:17:47,865
ANOTHER, UNTIL HE DECIDES TO
COOPERATE.
>> Logan: THIS INDIVIDUAL, WHY
637
00:17:47,867 --> 00:17:49,233
COOPERATE.
>> Logan: THIS INDIVIDUAL, WHY
WERE THEY PUT IN CHARGE?
638
00:17:49,235 --> 00:17:51,302
>> Logan: THIS INDIVIDUAL, WHY
WERE THEY PUT IN CHARGE?
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
639
00:17:51,304 --> 00:17:51,903
WERE THEY PUT IN CHARGE?
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
SUPPOSEDLY, HE'S AN EXPERT IN
640
00:17:51,905 --> 00:17:54,305
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
SUPPOSEDLY, HE'S AN EXPERT IN
THE FIELD.
641
00:17:54,307 --> 00:17:54,972
SUPPOSEDLY, HE'S AN EXPERT IN
THE FIELD.
SO I ASK HIM, "DO YOU KNOW
642
00:17:54,974 --> 00:17:55,573
THE FIELD.
SO I ASK HIM, "DO YOU KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT ISLAMIC
643
00:17:55,575 --> 00:17:56,908
SO I ASK HIM, "DO YOU KNOW
ANYTHING ABOUT ISLAMIC
FUNDAMENTALISM?"
644
00:17:56,910 --> 00:17:58,609
ANYTHING ABOUT ISLAMIC
FUNDAMENTALISM?"
HE SAID, "NO."
645
00:17:58,611 --> 00:17:59,177
FUNDAMENTALISM?"
HE SAID, "NO."
"HAVE YOU EVER INTERROGATED
646
00:17:59,179 --> 00:18:01,512
HE SAID, "NO."
"HAVE YOU EVER INTERROGATED
ANYBODY?"
647
00:18:01,514 --> 00:18:02,313
"HAVE YOU EVER INTERROGATED
ANYBODY?"
"NO."
648
00:18:02,315 --> 00:18:02,947
ANYBODY?"
"NO."
HE BASICALLY SAID, NO, HE KNOWS
649
00:18:02,949 --> 00:18:05,249
"NO."
HE BASICALLY SAID, NO, HE KNOWS
HUMAN NATURE.
650
00:18:05,251 --> 00:18:06,350
HE BASICALLY SAID, NO, HE KNOWS
HUMAN NATURE.
>> Logan: AND HOW DOES ABU
651
00:18:06,352 --> 00:18:07,785
HUMAN NATURE.
>> Logan: AND HOW DOES ABU
ZUBAYDAH REACT TO THIS?
652
00:18:07,787 --> 00:18:08,419
>> Logan: AND HOW DOES ABU
ZUBAYDAH REACT TO THIS?
>> Soufan: HE BASICALLY STOPPED
653
00:18:08,421 --> 00:18:10,488
ZUBAYDAH REACT TO THIS?
>> Soufan: HE BASICALLY STOPPED
COOPERATING.
654
00:18:10,490 --> 00:18:11,122
>> Soufan: HE BASICALLY STOPPED
COOPERATING.
>> Logan: THE INFORMATION DRIED
655
00:18:11,124 --> 00:18:11,289
COOPERATING.
>> Logan: THE INFORMATION DRIED
UP?
656
00:18:11,291 --> 00:18:13,958
>> Logan: THE INFORMATION DRIED
UP?
>> Soufan: YES, TOTALLY.
657
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:16,060
UP?
>> Soufan: YES, TOTALLY.
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS THAT,
658
00:18:16,062 --> 00:18:17,061
>> Soufan: YES, TOTALLY.
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS THAT,
AFTER SEVERAL DAYS WITH NOTHING
659
00:18:17,063 --> 00:18:18,663
>> Logan: SOUFAN SAYS THAT,
AFTER SEVERAL DAYS WITH NOTHING
FROM ABU ZUBAYDAH, HE AND HIS
660
00:18:18,665 --> 00:18:19,897
AFTER SEVERAL DAYS WITH NOTHING
FROM ABU ZUBAYDAH, HE AND HIS
PARTNER AND A CIA INTERROGATOR
661
00:18:19,899 --> 00:18:21,165
FROM ABU ZUBAYDAH, HE AND HIS
PARTNER AND A CIA INTERROGATOR
WERE ALLOWED TO START TALKING TO
662
00:18:21,167 --> 00:18:23,601
PARTNER AND A CIA INTERROGATOR
WERE ALLOWED TO START TALKING TO
HIM ONCE AGAIN.
663
00:18:23,603 --> 00:18:25,837
WERE ALLOWED TO START TALKING TO
HIM ONCE AGAIN.
AND THEY OBTAINED INFORMATION
664
00:18:25,839 --> 00:18:27,138
HIM ONCE AGAIN.
AND THEY OBTAINED INFORMATION
THAT LED THE CIA AND THE FBI TO
665
00:18:27,140 --> 00:18:28,706
AND THEY OBTAINED INFORMATION
THAT LED THE CIA AND THE FBI TO
CAPTURE THIS MAN, JOSE PADILLA,
666
00:18:28,708 --> 00:18:32,710
THAT LED THE CIA AND THE FBI TO
CAPTURE THIS MAN, JOSE PADILLA,
THE AMERICAN CITIZEN ACCUSED OF
667
00:18:32,712 --> 00:18:33,578
CAPTURE THIS MAN, JOSE PADILLA,
THE AMERICAN CITIZEN ACCUSED OF
PLOTTING TO SET OFF A "DIRTY
668
00:18:33,580 --> 00:18:35,847
THE AMERICAN CITIZEN ACCUSED OF
PLOTTING TO SET OFF A "DIRTY
BOMB" IN THE U.S.
669
00:18:35,849 --> 00:18:37,014
PLOTTING TO SET OFF A "DIRTY
BOMB" IN THE U.S.
SO YOUR FEELING IS, AT THIS
670
00:18:37,016 --> 00:18:39,484
BOMB" IN THE U.S.
SO YOUR FEELING IS, AT THIS
POINT, THAT YOUR TECHNIQUE
671
00:18:39,486 --> 00:18:40,485
SO YOUR FEELING IS, AT THIS
POINT, THAT YOUR TECHNIQUE
HAS... HAS STARTED TO WORK
672
00:18:40,487 --> 00:18:41,119
POINT, THAT YOUR TECHNIQUE
HAS... HAS STARTED TO WORK
AGAIN?
673
00:18:41,121 --> 00:18:41,919
HAS... HAS STARTED TO WORK
AGAIN?
>> Soufan: WE... WE'RE BACK.
674
00:18:41,921 --> 00:18:43,020
AGAIN?
>> Soufan: WE... WE'RE BACK.
YEAH, NO, WE'RE BACK.
675
00:18:43,022 --> 00:18:45,456
>> Soufan: WE... WE'RE BACK.
YEAH, NO, WE'RE BACK.
AND... AND MORE INFORMATION
676
00:18:45,458 --> 00:18:48,392
YEAH, NO, WE'RE BACK.
AND... AND MORE INFORMATION
STARTS COMING.
677
00:18:48,394 --> 00:18:49,594
AND... AND MORE INFORMATION
STARTS COMING.
AND THEN, SUDDENLY, OUT OF THE
678
00:18:49,596 --> 00:18:51,762
STARTS COMING.
AND THEN, SUDDENLY, OUT OF THE
BLUE, THEY SAID, "WAIT A SECOND.
679
00:18:51,764 --> 00:18:56,601
AND THEN, SUDDENLY, OUT OF THE
BLUE, THEY SAID, "WAIT A SECOND.
YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO BE OUT,
680
00:18:56,603 --> 00:18:58,769
BLUE, THEY SAID, "WAIT A SECOND.
YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO BE OUT,
BECAUSE WE BELIEVE HE'S NOT
681
00:18:58,771 --> 00:19:00,404
YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO BE OUT,
BECAUSE WE BELIEVE HE'S NOT
COOPERATING ANYMORE," WHICH WAS
682
00:19:00,406 --> 00:19:02,740
BECAUSE WE BELIEVE HE'S NOT
COOPERATING ANYMORE," WHICH WAS
REALLY SHOCKING FOR US TO HEAR.
683
00:19:02,742 --> 00:19:03,641
COOPERATING ANYMORE," WHICH WAS
REALLY SHOCKING FOR US TO HEAR.
>> Logan: SO WHAT DID YOU DO?
684
00:19:03,643 --> 00:19:05,543
REALLY SHOCKING FOR US TO HEAR.
>> Logan: SO WHAT DID YOU DO?
>> Soufan: WHAT CAN WE DO?
685
00:19:05,545 --> 00:19:07,745
>> Logan: SO WHAT DID YOU DO?
>> Soufan: WHAT CAN WE DO?
WE'RE WATCHING TIME PASS BY WITH
686
00:19:07,747 --> 00:19:09,180
>> Soufan: WHAT CAN WE DO?
WE'RE WATCHING TIME PASS BY WITH
NOBODY TALKING TO A DETAINEE,
687
00:19:09,182 --> 00:19:12,049
WE'RE WATCHING TIME PASS BY WITH
NOBODY TALKING TO A DETAINEE,
DAY AFTER DAY.
688
00:19:12,051 --> 00:19:12,817
NOBODY TALKING TO A DETAINEE,
DAY AFTER DAY.
>> Logan: NO ONE EVEN SPOKE TO
689
00:19:12,819 --> 00:19:13,784
DAY AFTER DAY.
>> Logan: NO ONE EVEN SPOKE TO
HIM?
690
00:19:13,786 --> 00:19:14,685
>> Logan: NO ONE EVEN SPOKE TO
HIM?
>> Soufan: NO, THEY GO IN.
691
00:19:14,687 --> 00:19:15,286
HIM?
>> Soufan: NO, THEY GO IN.
THEY SAY, "TELL ME WHAT I WANT
692
00:19:15,288 --> 00:19:16,154
>> Soufan: NO, THEY GO IN.
THEY SAY, "TELL ME WHAT I WANT
TO KNOW."
693
00:19:16,156 --> 00:19:17,455
THEY SAY, "TELL ME WHAT I WANT
TO KNOW."
HE SAYS, "WHAT DO YOU WANT TO
694
00:19:17,457 --> 00:19:18,689
TO KNOW."
HE SAYS, "WHAT DO YOU WANT TO
KNOW?"
695
00:19:18,691 --> 00:19:20,825
HE SAYS, "WHAT DO YOU WANT TO
KNOW?"
AND YOU WALK OUT, PERIOD.
696
00:19:20,827 --> 00:19:21,359
KNOW?"
AND YOU WALK OUT, PERIOD.
THAT'S IT.
697
00:19:21,361 --> 00:19:22,693
AND YOU WALK OUT, PERIOD.
THAT'S IT.
THAT'S THE WHOLE INTERROGATION
698
00:19:22,695 --> 00:19:24,795
THAT'S IT.
THAT'S THE WHOLE INTERROGATION
"PLAN," IF YOU WANT TO CALL IT.
699
00:19:24,797 --> 00:19:25,997
THAT'S THE WHOLE INTERROGATION
"PLAN," IF YOU WANT TO CALL IT.
>> Logan: SO THERE'S SOMETHING
700
00:19:25,999 --> 00:19:27,431
"PLAN," IF YOU WANT TO CALL IT.
>> Logan: SO THERE'S SOMETHING
THAT HAPPENS.
701
00:19:27,433 --> 00:19:28,633
>> Logan: SO THERE'S SOMETHING
THAT HAPPENS.
IT ESCALATES TO A POINT WHERE
702
00:19:28,635 --> 00:19:30,768
THAT HAPPENS.
IT ESCALATES TO A POINT WHERE
YOU DECIDE, THAT'S IT, YOU'RE
703
00:19:30,770 --> 00:19:31,769
IT ESCALATES TO A POINT WHERE
YOU DECIDE, THAT'S IT, YOU'RE
LEAVING.
704
00:19:31,771 --> 00:19:32,470
YOU DECIDE, THAT'S IT, YOU'RE
LEAVING.
WHAT IS IT?
705
00:19:32,472 --> 00:19:33,271
LEAVING.
WHAT IS IT?
>> Soufan: THERE WAS A
706
00:19:33,273 --> 00:19:34,772
WHAT IS IT?
>> Soufan: THERE WAS A
CONFINEMENT BOX.
707
00:19:34,774 --> 00:19:35,339
>> Soufan: THERE WAS A
CONFINEMENT BOX.
>> Logan: THAT SOUNDS LIKE A
708
00:19:35,341 --> 00:19:37,542
CONFINEMENT BOX.
>> Logan: THAT SOUNDS LIKE A
COFFIN.
709
00:19:37,544 --> 00:19:40,611
>> Logan: THAT SOUNDS LIKE A
COFFIN.
>> Soufan: UH... "CONFINEMENT
710
00:19:40,613 --> 00:19:41,712
COFFIN.
>> Soufan: UH... "CONFINEMENT
BOX," AND I CAME ONE DAY, AND I
711
00:19:41,714 --> 00:19:44,415
>> Soufan: UH... "CONFINEMENT
BOX," AND I CAME ONE DAY, AND I
SAW IT IN THE FACILITY.
712
00:19:44,417 --> 00:19:45,583
BOX," AND I CAME ONE DAY, AND I
SAW IT IN THE FACILITY.
AND I THOUGHT, AT THE TIME, "WE
713
00:19:45,585 --> 00:19:47,318
SAW IT IN THE FACILITY.
AND I THOUGHT, AT THE TIME, "WE
HAD THE GUY COOPERATING.
714
00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:48,586
AND I THOUGHT, AT THE TIME, "WE
HAD THE GUY COOPERATING.
SO WHAT'S GOING ON?"
715
00:19:48,588 --> 00:19:49,487
HAD THE GUY COOPERATING.
SO WHAT'S GOING ON?"
I MEAN, THAT BOX WAS NOT MADE
716
00:19:49,489 --> 00:19:50,821
SO WHAT'S GOING ON?"
I MEAN, THAT BOX WAS NOT MADE
OVERNIGHT.
717
00:19:50,823 --> 00:19:52,490
I MEAN, THAT BOX WAS NOT MADE
OVERNIGHT.
THERE'S SOMETHING GOING ON AND
718
00:19:52,492 --> 00:19:53,958
OVERNIGHT.
THERE'S SOMETHING GOING ON AND
WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT.
719
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:55,092
THERE'S SOMETHING GOING ON AND
WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT.
>> Logan: WHAT WAS THE BOX FOR?
720
00:19:55,094 --> 00:19:58,229
WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT.
>> Logan: WHAT WAS THE BOX FOR?
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
721
00:19:58,231 --> 00:19:59,463
>> Logan: WHAT WAS THE BOX FOR?
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
I MEAN, DEFINITELY, IT'S... IT'S
722
00:19:59,465 --> 00:20:01,766
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
I MEAN, DEFINITELY, IT'S... IT'S
FOR... FOR ABU ZUBAYDAH.
723
00:20:01,768 --> 00:20:03,467
I MEAN, DEFINITELY, IT'S... IT'S
FOR... FOR ABU ZUBAYDAH.
>> Logan: BUT THAT WAS NOT THE
724
00:20:03,469 --> 00:20:05,236
FOR... FOR ABU ZUBAYDAH.
>> Logan: BUT THAT WAS NOT THE
KIND OF TECHNIQUE THAT YOU WERE
725
00:20:05,238 --> 00:20:06,671
>> Logan: BUT THAT WAS NOT THE
KIND OF TECHNIQUE THAT YOU WERE
PREPARED TO STICK AROUND FOR?
726
00:20:06,673 --> 00:20:08,606
KIND OF TECHNIQUE THAT YOU WERE
PREPARED TO STICK AROUND FOR?
>> Soufan: NO.
727
00:20:08,608 --> 00:20:09,640
PREPARED TO STICK AROUND FOR?
>> Soufan: NO.
I JUST FELT THAT, LITERALLY,
728
00:20:09,642 --> 00:20:12,910
>> Soufan: NO.
I JUST FELT THAT, LITERALLY,
"WE'RE PLAYING GAMES, AND I
729
00:20:12,912 --> 00:20:14,645
I JUST FELT THAT, LITERALLY,
"WE'RE PLAYING GAMES, AND I
REALLY CANNOT BE PART OF THIS."
730
00:20:14,647 --> 00:20:15,279
"WE'RE PLAYING GAMES, AND I
REALLY CANNOT BE PART OF THIS."
>> Logan: SOUFAN CLAIMS HE
731
00:20:15,281 --> 00:20:15,913
REALLY CANNOT BE PART OF THIS."
>> Logan: SOUFAN CLAIMS HE
WASN'T THE ONLY PERSON THAT FELT
732
00:20:15,915 --> 00:20:18,616
>> Logan: SOUFAN CLAIMS HE
WASN'T THE ONLY PERSON THAT FELT
THAT WAY.
733
00:20:18,618 --> 00:20:20,384
WASN'T THE ONLY PERSON THAT FELT
THAT WAY.
>> Soufan: AT LEAST ONE OF THE
734
00:20:20,386 --> 00:20:21,485
THAT WAY.
>> Soufan: AT LEAST ONE OF THE
CIA GUYS SAID, "YOU KNOW WHAT?
735
00:20:21,487 --> 00:20:22,119
>> Soufan: AT LEAST ONE OF THE
CIA GUYS SAID, "YOU KNOW WHAT?
THAT'S NOT WORTH IT.
736
00:20:22,121 --> 00:20:23,087
CIA GUYS SAID, "YOU KNOW WHAT?
THAT'S NOT WORTH IT.
I'M NOT GOING TO DO THIS."
737
00:20:23,089 --> 00:20:23,888
THAT'S NOT WORTH IT.
I'M NOT GOING TO DO THIS."
HE LEFT.
738
00:20:23,890 --> 00:20:26,324
I'M NOT GOING TO DO THIS."
HE LEFT.
HE LEFT THE LOCATION...
739
00:20:26,326 --> 00:20:27,158
HE LEFT.
HE LEFT THE LOCATION...
>> Logan: ANOTHER CIA AGENT ON
740
00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:27,758
HE LEFT THE LOCATION...
>> Logan: ANOTHER CIA AGENT ON
THE GROUND?
741
00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:28,392
>> Logan: ANOTHER CIA AGENT ON
THE GROUND?
>> Soufan: YEAH.
742
00:20:28,394 --> 00:20:30,962
THE GROUND?
>> Soufan: YEAH.
ACTUALLY, HE LEFT BEFORE ME.
743
00:20:30,964 --> 00:20:32,496
>> Soufan: YEAH.
ACTUALLY, HE LEFT BEFORE ME.
AND THEN... AND THEN WE FINALLY
744
00:20:32,498 --> 00:20:34,498
ACTUALLY, HE LEFT BEFORE ME.
AND THEN... AND THEN WE FINALLY
REPORTED TO HEADQUARTERS THAT,
745
00:20:34,500 --> 00:20:35,833
AND THEN... AND THEN WE FINALLY
REPORTED TO HEADQUARTERS THAT,
YOU KNOW, "THIS IS WHAT'S
746
00:20:35,835 --> 00:20:38,703
REPORTED TO HEADQUARTERS THAT,
YOU KNOW, "THIS IS WHAT'S
HAPPENING," AS I CALLED IT IN
747
00:20:38,705 --> 00:20:40,705
YOU KNOW, "THIS IS WHAT'S
HAPPENING," AS I CALLED IT IN
THE D.O.J.-- DEPARTMENT OF
748
00:20:40,707 --> 00:20:42,273
HAPPENING," AS I CALLED IT IN
THE D.O.J.-- DEPARTMENT OF
JUSTICE INSPECTOR GENERAL--
749
00:20:42,275 --> 00:20:44,408
THE D.O.J.-- DEPARTMENT OF
JUSTICE INSPECTOR GENERAL--
REPORT, "BORDERLINE TORTURE."
750
00:20:44,410 --> 00:20:45,610
JUSTICE INSPECTOR GENERAL--
REPORT, "BORDERLINE TORTURE."
AND-- FBI HEADQUARTERS SAID,
751
00:20:45,612 --> 00:20:47,044
REPORT, "BORDERLINE TORTURE."
AND-- FBI HEADQUARTERS SAID,
"YOU KNOW... YOU KNOW WE DON'T
752
00:20:47,046 --> 00:20:49,580
AND-- FBI HEADQUARTERS SAID,
"YOU KNOW... YOU KNOW WE DON'T
DO THAT, JUST..."
753
00:20:49,582 --> 00:20:51,549
"YOU KNOW... YOU KNOW WE DON'T
DO THAT, JUST..."
AND, EVENTUALLY, AFTER THAT,
754
00:20:51,551 --> 00:20:53,084
DO THAT, JUST..."
AND, EVENTUALLY, AFTER THAT,
THEY PULLED ALL FBI AGENTS FROM
755
00:20:53,086 --> 00:20:56,220
AND, EVENTUALLY, AFTER THAT,
THEY PULLED ALL FBI AGENTS FROM
HIGH-VALUE DETAINEES
756
00:20:56,222 --> 00:20:57,855
THEY PULLED ALL FBI AGENTS FROM
HIGH-VALUE DETAINEES
INTERROGATIONS.
757
00:20:57,857 --> 00:20:59,090
HIGH-VALUE DETAINEES
INTERROGATIONS.
>> Logan: SOUFAN NEVER SAW ABU
758
00:20:59,092 --> 00:21:01,092
INTERROGATIONS.
>> Logan: SOUFAN NEVER SAW ABU
ZUBAYDAH AGAIN, AND ONLY
759
00:21:01,094 --> 00:21:01,859
>> Logan: SOUFAN NEVER SAW ABU
ZUBAYDAH AGAIN, AND ONLY
OCCASIONALLY SAW THESE
760
00:21:01,861 --> 00:21:03,861
ZUBAYDAH AGAIN, AND ONLY
OCCASIONALLY SAW THESE
TECHNIQUES BEING USED AFTER
761
00:21:03,863 --> 00:21:05,062
OCCASIONALLY SAW THESE
TECHNIQUES BEING USED AFTER
THAT, BUT HE CLAIMS THAT WHEN
762
00:21:05,064 --> 00:21:09,433
TECHNIQUES BEING USED AFTER
THAT, BUT HE CLAIMS THAT WHEN
PRESIDENT GEORGE BUSH ADDRESSED
763
00:21:09,435 --> 00:21:10,868
THAT, BUT HE CLAIMS THAT WHEN
PRESIDENT GEORGE BUSH ADDRESSED
THE NATION IN 2006, THE AMERICAN
764
00:21:10,870 --> 00:21:12,703
PRESIDENT GEORGE BUSH ADDRESSED
THE NATION IN 2006, THE AMERICAN
PEOPLE WERE BEING MISLED.
765
00:21:12,705 --> 00:21:13,437
THE NATION IN 2006, THE AMERICAN
PEOPLE WERE BEING MISLED.
>> President George Bush: WE
766
00:21:13,439 --> 00:21:14,772
PEOPLE WERE BEING MISLED.
>> President George Bush: WE
KNEW THAT ZUBAYDAH HAD MORE
767
00:21:14,774 --> 00:21:16,574
>> President George Bush: WE
KNEW THAT ZUBAYDAH HAD MORE
INFORMATION THAT COULD SAVE
768
00:21:16,576 --> 00:21:18,843
KNEW THAT ZUBAYDAH HAD MORE
INFORMATION THAT COULD SAVE
INNOCENT LIVES, BUT HE STOPPED
769
00:21:18,845 --> 00:21:20,011
INFORMATION THAT COULD SAVE
INNOCENT LIVES, BUT HE STOPPED
TALKING.
770
00:21:20,013 --> 00:21:21,345
INNOCENT LIVES, BUT HE STOPPED
TALKING.
IT BECAME CLEAR THAT HE HAD
771
00:21:21,347 --> 00:21:23,314
TALKING.
IT BECAME CLEAR THAT HE HAD
RECEIVED TRAINING ON HOW TO
772
00:21:23,316 --> 00:21:28,119
IT BECAME CLEAR THAT HE HAD
RECEIVED TRAINING ON HOW TO
RESIST INTERROGATION.
773
00:21:28,121 --> 00:21:28,719
RECEIVED TRAINING ON HOW TO
RESIST INTERROGATION.
AND SO THE CIA USED AN
774
00:21:28,721 --> 00:21:29,787
RESIST INTERROGATION.
AND SO THE CIA USED AN
ALTERNATIVE SET OF PROCEDURES.
775
00:21:29,789 --> 00:21:31,289
AND SO THE CIA USED AN
ALTERNATIVE SET OF PROCEDURES.
>> Soufan: I THINK SOMEBODY TOLD
776
00:21:31,291 --> 00:21:34,358
ALTERNATIVE SET OF PROCEDURES.
>> Soufan: I THINK SOMEBODY TOLD
THE PRESIDENT SOME FAKE
777
00:21:34,360 --> 00:21:34,925
>> Soufan: I THINK SOMEBODY TOLD
THE PRESIDENT SOME FAKE
INFORMATION, SOME FALSE
778
00:21:34,927 --> 00:21:37,995
THE PRESIDENT SOME FAKE
INFORMATION, SOME FALSE
INFORMATION.
779
00:21:37,997 --> 00:21:38,596
INFORMATION, SOME FALSE
INFORMATION.
ZUBAYDAH DID NOT STOP TALKING;
780
00:21:38,598 --> 00:21:39,864
INFORMATION.
ZUBAYDAH DID NOT STOP TALKING;
INTRODUCING THE TECHNIQUES MADE
781
00:21:39,866 --> 00:21:42,133
ZUBAYDAH DID NOT STOP TALKING;
INTRODUCING THE TECHNIQUES MADE
HIM STOP TALKING.
782
00:21:42,135 --> 00:21:43,034
INTRODUCING THE TECHNIQUES MADE
HIM STOP TALKING.
>> Logan: SOUFAN ARGUES THAT
783
00:21:43,036 --> 00:21:44,769
HIM STOP TALKING.
>> Logan: SOUFAN ARGUES THAT
TERRORISTS LIKE ABU ZUBAYDAH
784
00:21:44,771 --> 00:21:45,770
>> Logan: SOUFAN ARGUES THAT
TERRORISTS LIKE ABU ZUBAYDAH
HAVE BEEN TRAINED TO EXPECT
785
00:21:45,772 --> 00:21:47,638
TERRORISTS LIKE ABU ZUBAYDAH
HAVE BEEN TRAINED TO EXPECT
EXTREMELY BRUTAL TREATMENT IN
786
00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:49,974
HAVE BEEN TRAINED TO EXPECT
EXTREMELY BRUTAL TREATMENT IN
MIDDLE EASTERN PRISONS, WHICH IS
787
00:21:49,976 --> 00:21:51,042
EXTREMELY BRUTAL TREATMENT IN
MIDDLE EASTERN PRISONS, WHICH IS
ONE REASON HE BELIEVES ENHANCED
788
00:21:51,044 --> 00:21:52,310
MIDDLE EASTERN PRISONS, WHICH IS
ONE REASON HE BELIEVES ENHANCED
INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES ARE NOT
789
00:21:52,312 --> 00:21:55,479
ONE REASON HE BELIEVES ENHANCED
INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES ARE NOT
EFFECTIVE.
790
00:21:55,481 --> 00:21:56,514
INTERROGATION TECHNIQUES ARE NOT
EFFECTIVE.
>> Soufan: IF YOU LOOK AT THEM
791
00:21:56,516 --> 00:21:57,748
EFFECTIVE.
>> Soufan: IF YOU LOOK AT THEM
FROM AN AMERICAN PERSPECTIVE,
792
00:21:57,750 --> 00:21:58,282
>> Soufan: IF YOU LOOK AT THEM
FROM AN AMERICAN PERSPECTIVE,
YOU WILL SAY, "WOW, THAT'S
793
00:21:58,284 --> 00:21:59,650
FROM AN AMERICAN PERSPECTIVE,
YOU WILL SAY, "WOW, THAT'S
TORTURE."
794
00:21:59,652 --> 00:22:01,552
YOU WILL SAY, "WOW, THAT'S
TORTURE."
BUT REALLY, THAT'S LIKE SAYING
795
00:22:01,554 --> 00:22:02,253
TORTURE."
BUT REALLY, THAT'S LIKE SAYING
HELLO IN SOME JAIL IN THE MIDDLE
796
00:22:02,255 --> 00:22:05,022
BUT REALLY, THAT'S LIKE SAYING
HELLO IN SOME JAIL IN THE MIDDLE
EAST.
797
00:22:05,024 --> 00:22:05,690
HELLO IN SOME JAIL IN THE MIDDLE
EAST.
I MEAN, THE... LITERALLY, THIS
798
00:22:05,692 --> 00:22:06,290
EAST.
I MEAN, THE... LITERALLY, THIS
IS NOT THE TORTURE THAT THESE
799
00:22:06,292 --> 00:22:09,427
I MEAN, THE... LITERALLY, THIS
IS NOT THE TORTURE THAT THESE
GUYS ARE EXPECTING.
800
00:22:09,429 --> 00:22:11,329
IS NOT THE TORTURE THAT THESE
GUYS ARE EXPECTING.
SO WHY DO WE START GOING ON A
801
00:22:11,331 --> 00:22:14,231
GUYS ARE EXPECTING.
SO WHY DO WE START GOING ON A
PATH THAT EVENTUALLY WE'RE GOING
802
00:22:14,233 --> 00:22:16,567
SO WHY DO WE START GOING ON A
PATH THAT EVENTUALLY WE'RE GOING
TO HIT A GLASS CEILING?
803
00:22:16,569 --> 00:22:17,301
PATH THAT EVENTUALLY WE'RE GOING
TO HIT A GLASS CEILING?
AND WHEN YOU HIT THE GLASS
804
00:22:17,303 --> 00:22:18,969
TO HIT A GLASS CEILING?
AND WHEN YOU HIT THE GLASS
CEILING, WHAT DO YOU DO?
805
00:22:18,971 --> 00:22:20,438
AND WHEN YOU HIT THE GLASS
CEILING, WHAT DO YOU DO?
>> Logan: WHAT DO YOU DO?
806
00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:21,038
CEILING, WHAT DO YOU DO?
>> Logan: WHAT DO YOU DO?
>> Soufan: THE DETAINEE CALLS
807
00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:22,173
>> Logan: WHAT DO YOU DO?
>> Soufan: THE DETAINEE CALLS
YOUR BLUFF.
808
00:22:22,175 --> 00:22:23,240
>> Soufan: THE DETAINEE CALLS
YOUR BLUFF.
YOU CANNOT GO BACK AND SAY, "I'M
809
00:22:23,242 --> 00:22:25,376
YOUR BLUFF.
YOU CANNOT GO BACK AND SAY, "I'M
GOING TO BUILD A RAPPORT."
810
00:22:25,378 --> 00:22:26,577
YOU CANNOT GO BACK AND SAY, "I'M
GOING TO BUILD A RAPPORT."
THAT'S WHY YOU KEEP REPEATING
811
00:22:26,579 --> 00:22:28,079
GOING TO BUILD A RAPPORT."
THAT'S WHY YOU KEEP REPEATING
THE GLASS CEILING AGAIN AND
812
00:22:28,081 --> 00:22:31,649
THAT'S WHY YOU KEEP REPEATING
THE GLASS CEILING AGAIN AND
AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN.
813
00:22:31,651 --> 00:22:33,684
THE GLASS CEILING AGAIN AND
AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN.
ABU ZUBAYDAH WAS WATER-BOARDED
814
00:22:33,686 --> 00:22:36,454
AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN.
ABU ZUBAYDAH WAS WATER-BOARDED
83 TIMES; KHALID SHEIKH
815
00:22:36,456 --> 00:22:38,222
ABU ZUBAYDAH WAS WATER-BOARDED
83 TIMES; KHALID SHEIKH
MOHAMMED, 183 TIMES.
816
00:22:38,224 --> 00:22:39,724
83 TIMES; KHALID SHEIKH
MOHAMMED, 183 TIMES.
WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?
817
00:22:39,726 --> 00:22:40,358
MOHAMMED, 183 TIMES.
WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?
DOES THAT TELL YOU THE TECHNIQUE
818
00:22:40,360 --> 00:22:42,126
WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?
DOES THAT TELL YOU THE TECHNIQUE
IS WORKING?
819
00:22:42,128 --> 00:22:43,260
DOES THAT TELL YOU THE TECHNIQUE
IS WORKING?
>> Logan: A NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN
820
00:22:43,262 --> 00:22:44,362
IS WORKING?
>> Logan: A NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN
THE CIA AND THE INTELLIGENCE
821
00:22:44,364 --> 00:22:46,097
>> Logan: A NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN
THE CIA AND THE INTELLIGENCE
COMMUNITY TOLD US THAT ABU
822
00:22:46,099 --> 00:22:49,266
THE CIA AND THE INTELLIGENCE
COMMUNITY TOLD US THAT ABU
ZUBAYDAH DID GIVE UP INFORMATION
823
00:22:49,268 --> 00:22:50,634
COMMUNITY TOLD US THAT ABU
ZUBAYDAH DID GIVE UP INFORMATION
AFTER HE WAS WATER-BOARDED,
824
00:22:50,636 --> 00:22:52,203
ZUBAYDAH DID GIVE UP INFORMATION
AFTER HE WAS WATER-BOARDED,
WHICH THEY SAY HELPED SAVE
825
00:22:52,205 --> 00:22:54,138
AFTER HE WAS WATER-BOARDED,
WHICH THEY SAY HELPED SAVE
AMERICAN LIVES, AND THAT, ALL
826
00:22:54,140 --> 00:22:55,206
WHICH THEY SAY HELPED SAVE
AMERICAN LIVES, AND THAT, ALL
MORAL QUESTIONS ASIDE, THE
827
00:22:55,208 --> 00:22:56,173
AMERICAN LIVES, AND THAT, ALL
MORAL QUESTIONS ASIDE, THE
ENHANCED INTERROGATION PROGRAM
828
00:22:56,175 --> 00:22:57,375
MORAL QUESTIONS ASIDE, THE
ENHANCED INTERROGATION PROGRAM
YIELDED SIGNIFICANT
829
00:22:57,377 --> 00:23:00,077
ENHANCED INTERROGATION PROGRAM
YIELDED SIGNIFICANT
INTELLIGENCE, INCLUDING
830
00:23:00,079 --> 00:23:02,580
YIELDED SIGNIFICANT
INTELLIGENCE, INCLUDING
INFORMATION THAT CONTRIBUTED TO
831
00:23:02,582 --> 00:23:06,083
INTELLIGENCE, INCLUDING
INFORMATION THAT CONTRIBUTED TO
THE KILLING OF OSAMA BIN LADEN.
832
00:23:06,085 --> 00:23:07,785
INFORMATION THAT CONTRIBUTED TO
THE KILLING OF OSAMA BIN LADEN.
AT LEAST TWO FORMER DIRECTORS OF
833
00:23:07,787 --> 00:23:09,353
THE KILLING OF OSAMA BIN LADEN.
AT LEAST TWO FORMER DIRECTORS OF
THE CIA, GEORGE TENET AND
834
00:23:09,355 --> 00:23:11,722
AT LEAST TWO FORMER DIRECTORS OF
THE CIA, GEORGE TENET AND
MICHAEL HAYDEN, SAY THAT
835
00:23:11,724 --> 00:23:13,090
THE CIA, GEORGE TENET AND
MICHAEL HAYDEN, SAY THAT
ENHANCED INTERROGATION
836
00:23:13,092 --> 00:23:14,325
MICHAEL HAYDEN, SAY THAT
ENHANCED INTERROGATION
TECHNIQUES DO WORK.
837
00:23:14,327 --> 00:23:15,459
ENHANCED INTERROGATION
TECHNIQUES DO WORK.
>> Soufan: SURE, SURE.
838
00:23:15,461 --> 00:23:16,327
TECHNIQUES DO WORK.
>> Soufan: SURE, SURE.
>> Logan: THEY HAVE ACCESS TO
839
00:23:16,329 --> 00:23:18,129
>> Soufan: SURE, SURE.
>> Logan: THEY HAVE ACCESS TO
MORE INTELLIGENCE THAN YOU.
840
00:23:18,131 --> 00:23:19,296
>> Logan: THEY HAVE ACCESS TO
MORE INTELLIGENCE THAN YOU.
>> Soufan: ABSOLUTELY.
841
00:23:19,298 --> 00:23:20,197
MORE INTELLIGENCE THAN YOU.
>> Soufan: ABSOLUTELY.
>> Logan: IF YOU DON'T KNOW
842
00:23:20,199 --> 00:23:21,232
>> Soufan: ABSOLUTELY.
>> Logan: IF YOU DON'T KNOW
EVERYTHING, HOW CAN YOU BE SO
843
00:23:21,234 --> 00:23:22,800
>> Logan: IF YOU DON'T KNOW
EVERYTHING, HOW CAN YOU BE SO
SURE THAT THEY DON'T WORK?
844
00:23:22,802 --> 00:23:24,034
EVERYTHING, HOW CAN YOU BE SO
SURE THAT THEY DON'T WORK?
>> Soufan: BECAUSE I AM PRIVY TO
845
00:23:24,036 --> 00:23:25,536
SURE THAT THEY DON'T WORK?
>> Soufan: BECAUSE I AM PRIVY TO
A LOT OF INFORMATION THAT ALSO
846
00:23:25,538 --> 00:23:27,004
>> Soufan: BECAUSE I AM PRIVY TO
A LOT OF INFORMATION THAT ALSO
I'M NOT TELLING YOU HERE.
847
00:23:27,006 --> 00:23:27,805
A LOT OF INFORMATION THAT ALSO
I'M NOT TELLING YOU HERE.
>> Logan: BUT IS IT POSSIBLE FOR
848
00:23:27,807 --> 00:23:30,040
I'M NOT TELLING YOU HERE.
>> Logan: BUT IS IT POSSIBLE FOR
YOU TO KNOW ALL THE INFORMATION,
849
00:23:30,042 --> 00:23:32,009
>> Logan: BUT IS IT POSSIBLE FOR
YOU TO KNOW ALL THE INFORMATION,
EVERYTHING THAT MAY OR MAY NOT
850
00:23:32,011 --> 00:23:32,743
YOU TO KNOW ALL THE INFORMATION,
EVERYTHING THAT MAY OR MAY NOT
HAVE BEEN GAINED FROM THESE
851
00:23:32,745 --> 00:23:34,979
EVERYTHING THAT MAY OR MAY NOT
HAVE BEEN GAINED FROM THESE
TECHNIQUES?
852
00:23:34,981 --> 00:23:35,613
HAVE BEEN GAINED FROM THESE
TECHNIQUES?
>> Soufan: I'M NOT CLAIMING THAT
853
00:23:35,615 --> 00:23:37,047
TECHNIQUES?
>> Soufan: I'M NOT CLAIMING THAT
I KNOW EVERYTHING.
854
00:23:37,049 --> 00:23:38,682
>> Soufan: I'M NOT CLAIMING THAT
I KNOW EVERYTHING.
I KNOW WHAT I KNOW.
855
00:23:38,684 --> 00:23:40,084
I KNOW EVERYTHING.
I KNOW WHAT I KNOW.
>> Logan: THE ONE THING THAT HAS
856
00:23:40,086 --> 00:23:42,553
I KNOW WHAT I KNOW.
>> Logan: THE ONE THING THAT HAS
CAUSED ALI SOUFAN MORE ANGUISH
857
00:23:42,555 --> 00:23:45,289
>> Logan: THE ONE THING THAT HAS
CAUSED ALI SOUFAN MORE ANGUISH
THAN ANYTHING ELSE IS THE
858
00:23:45,291 --> 00:23:46,690
CAUSED ALI SOUFAN MORE ANGUISH
THAN ANYTHING ELSE IS THE
THOUGHT THAT THE EVENTS OF 9/11
859
00:23:46,692 --> 00:23:47,324
THAN ANYTHING ELSE IS THE
THOUGHT THAT THE EVENTS OF 9/11
MIGHT HAVE BEEN PREVENTED-- IF,
860
00:23:47,326 --> 00:23:50,628
THOUGHT THAT THE EVENTS OF 9/11
MIGHT HAVE BEEN PREVENTED-- IF,
HE SAYS, THE CIA HAD SHARED
861
00:23:50,630 --> 00:23:52,663
MIGHT HAVE BEEN PREVENTED-- IF,
HE SAYS, THE CIA HAD SHARED
CERTAIN INFORMATION WITH HIM AND
862
00:23:52,665 --> 00:23:54,231
HE SAYS, THE CIA HAD SHARED
CERTAIN INFORMATION WITH HIM AND
HIS FBI TEAM.
863
00:23:54,233 --> 00:23:56,200
CERTAIN INFORMATION WITH HIM AND
HIS FBI TEAM.
WHILE THEY WERE INVESTIGATING
864
00:23:56,202 --> 00:23:59,770
HIS FBI TEAM.
WHILE THEY WERE INVESTIGATING
THE ATTACK ON THE U.S.S. "COLE"
865
00:23:59,772 --> 00:24:03,207
WHILE THEY WERE INVESTIGATING
THE ATTACK ON THE U.S.S. "COLE"
IN NOVEMBER 2000, SOUFAN'S TEAM
866
00:24:03,209 --> 00:24:04,642
THE ATTACK ON THE U.S.S. "COLE"
IN NOVEMBER 2000, SOUFAN'S TEAM
LEARNED THAT THIS AL QAEDA
867
00:24:04,644 --> 00:24:05,376
IN NOVEMBER 2000, SOUFAN'S TEAM
LEARNED THAT THIS AL QAEDA
OPERATIVE HAD MET WITH OTHER
868
00:24:05,378 --> 00:24:06,010
LEARNED THAT THIS AL QAEDA
OPERATIVE HAD MET WITH OTHER
TERRORISTS IN ASIA AND RECEIVED
869
00:24:06,012 --> 00:24:06,677
OPERATIVE HAD MET WITH OTHER
TERRORISTS IN ASIA AND RECEIVED
A LARGE SUM OF MONEY.
870
00:24:06,679 --> 00:24:09,246
TERRORISTS IN ASIA AND RECEIVED
A LARGE SUM OF MONEY.
SOUFAN SAYS HE ASKED THE CIA IF
871
00:24:09,248 --> 00:24:11,315
A LARGE SUM OF MONEY.
SOUFAN SAYS HE ASKED THE CIA IF
IT KNEW WHAT THIS OPERATIVE WAS
872
00:24:11,317 --> 00:24:14,518
SOUFAN SAYS HE ASKED THE CIA IF
IT KNEW WHAT THIS OPERATIVE WAS
UP TO.
873
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:15,486
IT KNEW WHAT THIS OPERATIVE WAS
UP TO.
YOU MADE THREE FORMAL REQUESTS
874
00:24:15,488 --> 00:24:17,121
UP TO.
YOU MADE THREE FORMAL REQUESTS
TO THE CIA...
875
00:24:17,123 --> 00:24:24,795
YOU MADE THREE FORMAL REQUESTS
TO THE CIA...
>> Soufan: THERE WAS THREE
876
00:24:24,797 --> 00:24:27,598
TO THE CIA...
>> Soufan: THERE WAS THREE
FORMAL REQUESTS.
877
00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:28,165
>> Soufan: THERE WAS THREE
FORMAL REQUESTS.
>> Logan: ...THROUGH THE FBI
878
00:24:28,167 --> 00:24:28,566
FORMAL REQUESTS.
>> Logan: ...THROUGH THE FBI
CHAIN?
879
00:24:28,568 --> 00:24:29,033
>> Logan: ...THROUGH THE FBI
CHAIN?
>> Soufan: RIGHT.
880
00:24:29,035 --> 00:24:29,800
CHAIN?
>> Soufan: RIGHT.
>> Logan: AND TIME AND AGAIN,
881
00:24:29,802 --> 00:24:30,401
>> Soufan: RIGHT.
>> Logan: AND TIME AND AGAIN,
THE CIA TELL YOU WHAT?
882
00:24:30,403 --> 00:24:30,968
>> Logan: AND TIME AND AGAIN,
THE CIA TELL YOU WHAT?
>> Soufan: THEY DON'T KNOW
883
00:24:30,970 --> 00:24:31,435
THE CIA TELL YOU WHAT?
>> Soufan: THEY DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING.
884
00:24:31,437 --> 00:24:32,136
>> Soufan: THEY DON'T KNOW
ANYTHING.
>> Logan: BUT SOUFAN SAYS HE
885
00:24:32,138 --> 00:24:32,736
ANYTHING.
>> Logan: BUT SOUFAN SAYS HE
LATER LEARNED THE CIA KNEW,
886
00:24:32,738 --> 00:24:33,704
>> Logan: BUT SOUFAN SAYS HE
LATER LEARNED THE CIA KNEW,
EIGHT MONTHS BEFORE 9/11, THAT
887
00:24:33,706 --> 00:24:34,305
LATER LEARNED THE CIA KNEW,
EIGHT MONTHS BEFORE 9/11, THAT
THIS SAME OPERATIVE HAD MET IN
888
00:24:34,307 --> 00:24:35,306
EIGHT MONTHS BEFORE 9/11, THAT
THIS SAME OPERATIVE HAD MET IN
MALAYSIA WITH TWO TERRORISM
889
00:24:35,308 --> 00:24:35,940
THIS SAME OPERATIVE HAD MET IN
MALAYSIA WITH TWO TERRORISM
SUSPECTS WHO WOULD LATER HIJACK
890
00:24:35,942 --> 00:24:36,574
MALAYSIA WITH TWO TERRORISM
SUSPECTS WHO WOULD LATER HIJACK
THE PLANE THAT CRASHED INTO THE
891
00:24:36,576 --> 00:24:36,874
SUSPECTS WHO WOULD LATER HIJACK
THE PLANE THAT CRASHED INTO THE
PENTAGON.
892
00:24:36,876 --> 00:24:37,842
THE PLANE THAT CRASHED INTO THE
PENTAGON.
AND THE CIA ALSO KNEW THAT THOSE
893
00:24:37,844 --> 00:24:38,876
PENTAGON.
AND THE CIA ALSO KNEW THAT THOSE
TWO SUSPECTS WERE HEADING TO THE
894
00:24:38,878 --> 00:24:42,346
AND THE CIA ALSO KNEW THAT THOSE
TWO SUSPECTS WERE HEADING TO THE
U.S.
895
00:24:42,348 --> 00:24:43,414
TWO SUSPECTS WERE HEADING TO THE
U.S.
>> Soufan: THE AGENCY KNEW THAT
896
00:24:43,416 --> 00:24:45,182
U.S.
>> Soufan: THE AGENCY KNEW THAT
THESE AL QAEDA OPERATIVES IN
897
00:24:45,184 --> 00:24:46,183
>> Soufan: THE AGENCY KNEW THAT
THESE AL QAEDA OPERATIVES IN
SOUTHEAST ASIA FLEW TO AMERICA,
898
00:24:46,185 --> 00:24:47,017
THESE AL QAEDA OPERATIVES IN
SOUTHEAST ASIA FLEW TO AMERICA,
OR THEY HAVE VISAS TO COME TO
899
00:24:47,019 --> 00:24:48,752
SOUTHEAST ASIA FLEW TO AMERICA,
OR THEY HAVE VISAS TO COME TO
THE UNITED STATES, AND SOMEBODY
900
00:24:48,754 --> 00:24:49,620
OR THEY HAVE VISAS TO COME TO
THE UNITED STATES, AND SOMEBODY
DECIDED, "LET'S NOT SHARE THE
901
00:24:49,622 --> 00:24:51,322
THE UNITED STATES, AND SOMEBODY
DECIDED, "LET'S NOT SHARE THE
INFORMATION."
902
00:24:51,324 --> 00:24:52,356
DECIDED, "LET'S NOT SHARE THE
INFORMATION."
>> Logan: AND IF IT HAD BEEN
903
00:24:52,358 --> 00:24:54,792
INFORMATION."
>> Logan: AND IF IT HAD BEEN
SHARED WITH YOU, WHAT THEN?
904
00:24:54,794 --> 00:24:56,227
>> Logan: AND IF IT HAD BEEN
SHARED WITH YOU, WHAT THEN?
>> Soufan: I TRY NOT TO THINK
905
00:24:56,229 --> 00:24:57,628
SHARED WITH YOU, WHAT THEN?
>> Soufan: I TRY NOT TO THINK
ABOUT THAT.
906
00:24:57,630 --> 00:24:58,863
>> Soufan: I TRY NOT TO THINK
ABOUT THAT.
I TRY NOT TO THINK ABOUT...
907
00:24:58,865 --> 00:25:01,665
ABOUT THAT.
I TRY NOT TO THINK ABOUT...
ABOUT WHAT COULD HAVE HAPPENED.
908
00:25:01,667 --> 00:25:05,769
I TRY NOT TO THINK ABOUT...
ABOUT WHAT COULD HAVE HAPPENED.
MAYBE... MAYBE THOUSANDS OF
909
00:25:05,771 --> 00:25:08,272
ABOUT WHAT COULD HAVE HAPPENED.
MAYBE... MAYBE THOUSANDS OF
AMERICAN LIVES WILL BE SPARED,
910
00:25:08,274 --> 00:25:10,541
MAYBE... MAYBE THOUSANDS OF
AMERICAN LIVES WILL BE SPARED,
MAYBE.
911
00:25:10,543 --> 00:25:11,909
AMERICAN LIVES WILL BE SPARED,
MAYBE.
>> Logan: THE CIA TOLD US ANY
912
00:25:11,911 --> 00:25:14,078
MAYBE.
>> Logan: THE CIA TOLD US ANY
SUGGESTION IT PURPOSELY REFUSED
913
00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,780
>> Logan: THE CIA TOLD US ANY
SUGGESTION IT PURPOSELY REFUSED
TO SHARE CRITICAL INFORMATION ON
914
00:25:16,782 --> 00:25:18,616
SUGGESTION IT PURPOSELY REFUSED
TO SHARE CRITICAL INFORMATION ON
THE 9/11 PLOTS WITH THE FBI IS
915
00:25:18,618 --> 00:25:21,118
TO SHARE CRITICAL INFORMATION ON
THE 9/11 PLOTS WITH THE FBI IS
"BASELESS" AND "THESE
916
00:25:21,120 --> 00:25:22,686
THE 9/11 PLOTS WITH THE FBI IS
"BASELESS" AND "THESE
ALLEGATIONS DIMINISH THE HARD
917
00:25:22,688 --> 00:25:23,687
"BASELESS" AND "THESE
ALLEGATIONS DIMINISH THE HARD
WORK AND DEDICATION OF COUNTLESS
918
00:25:23,689 --> 00:25:26,590
ALLEGATIONS DIMINISH THE HARD
WORK AND DEDICATION OF COUNTLESS
CIA OFFICERS."
919
00:25:26,592 --> 00:25:28,125
WORK AND DEDICATION OF COUNTLESS
CIA OFFICERS."
ALI SOUFAN LEFT THE FBI SIX
920
00:25:28,127 --> 00:25:29,827
CIA OFFICERS."
ALI SOUFAN LEFT THE FBI SIX
YEARS AGO AND, TODAY, HE RUNS A
921
00:25:29,829 --> 00:25:31,195
ALI SOUFAN LEFT THE FBI SIX
YEARS AGO AND, TODAY, HE RUNS A
SECURITY CONSULTING COMPANY
922
00:25:31,197 --> 00:25:37,601
YEARS AGO AND, TODAY, HE RUNS A
SECURITY CONSULTING COMPANY
BASED IN NEW YORK.
923
00:25:37,603 --> 00:25:38,202
SECURITY CONSULTING COMPANY
BASED IN NEW YORK.
HE TOLD US HE HASN'T BEEN TO
924
00:25:38,204 --> 00:25:39,103
BASED IN NEW YORK.
HE TOLD US HE HASN'T BEEN TO
GROUND ZERO SINCE THE FIRST
925
00:25:39,105 --> 00:25:40,738
HE TOLD US HE HASN'T BEEN TO
GROUND ZERO SINCE THE FIRST
ANNIVERSARY OF 9/11, AND THERE'S
926
00:25:40,740 --> 00:25:41,939
GROUND ZERO SINCE THE FIRST
ANNIVERSARY OF 9/11, AND THERE'S
A REASON FOR THAT.
927
00:25:41,941 --> 00:25:42,773
ANNIVERSARY OF 9/11, AND THERE'S
A REASON FOR THAT.
>> Soufan: MAYBE I'M ONE OF
928
00:25:42,775 --> 00:25:43,440
A REASON FOR THAT.
>> Soufan: MAYBE I'M ONE OF
THESE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T GET OVER
929
00:25:43,442 --> 00:25:44,942
>> Soufan: MAYBE I'M ONE OF
THESE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T GET OVER
IT.
930
00:25:44,944 --> 00:25:47,878
THESE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T GET OVER
IT.
>> Logan: CAN YOU TELL ME WHY?
931
00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:49,380
IT.
>> Logan: CAN YOU TELL ME WHY?
>> Soufan: YOU KNOW, MAYBE PART
932
00:25:49,382 --> 00:25:50,080
>> Logan: CAN YOU TELL ME WHY?
>> Soufan: YOU KNOW, MAYBE PART
OF ME FEELS GUILTY.
933
00:25:50,082 --> 00:25:53,284
>> Soufan: YOU KNOW, MAYBE PART
OF ME FEELS GUILTY.
MAYBE PART OF ME FEELS SOME SORT
934
00:25:53,286 --> 00:25:55,386
OF ME FEELS GUILTY.
MAYBE PART OF ME FEELS SOME SORT
OF RESPONSIBILITY OF WHAT
935
00:25:55,388 --> 00:25:57,154
MAYBE PART OF ME FEELS SOME SORT
OF RESPONSIBILITY OF WHAT
HAPPENED.
936
00:25:57,156 --> 00:25:57,855
OF RESPONSIBILITY OF WHAT
HAPPENED.
>> Logan: BUT YOU DID YOUR BEST.
937
00:25:57,857 --> 00:25:58,756
HAPPENED.
>> Logan: BUT YOU DID YOUR BEST.
YOU GAVE YOUR ALL.
938
00:25:58,758 --> 00:26:00,591
>> Logan: BUT YOU DID YOUR BEST.
YOU GAVE YOUR ALL.
WHY WOULD YOU FEEL GUILTY?
939
00:26:00,593 --> 00:26:02,359
YOU GAVE YOUR ALL.
WHY WOULD YOU FEEL GUILTY?
>> Soufan: IF YOU WANT TO BE
940
00:26:02,361 --> 00:26:03,661
WHY WOULD YOU FEEL GUILTY?
>> Soufan: IF YOU WANT TO BE
TRUTHFUL WITH YOURSELF, VERY
941
00:26:03,663 --> 00:26:05,396
>> Soufan: IF YOU WANT TO BE
TRUTHFUL WITH YOURSELF, VERY
DIFFICULT WHAT YOU FEEL... AND
942
00:26:05,398 --> 00:26:06,530
TRUTHFUL WITH YOURSELF, VERY
DIFFICULT WHAT YOU FEEL... AND
NOT TO KIND OF LIKE FEEL THAT,
943
00:26:06,532 --> 00:26:07,665
DIFFICULT WHAT YOU FEEL... AND
NOT TO KIND OF LIKE FEEL THAT,
YOU KNOW, "MAYBE I COULD'VE DONE
944
00:26:07,667 --> 00:26:13,103
NOT TO KIND OF LIKE FEEL THAT,
YOU KNOW, "MAYBE I COULD'VE DONE
SOMETHING."
945
00:26:13,105 --> 00:26:14,305
YOU KNOW, "MAYBE I COULD'VE DONE
SOMETHING."
>> Logan: IS THAT WHY IT'S HARD
946
00:26:14,307 --> 00:26:15,573
SOMETHING."
>> Logan: IS THAT WHY IT'S HARD
FOR YOU TO GO TO GROUND ZERO?
947
00:26:15,575 --> 00:26:18,709
>> Logan: IS THAT WHY IT'S HARD
FOR YOU TO GO TO GROUND ZERO?
>> Soufan: YEAH.
948
00:26:18,711 --> 00:26:20,010
FOR YOU TO GO TO GROUND ZERO?
>> Soufan: YEAH.
ACTUALLY, I WENT THERE ONCE, ON
949
00:26:20,012 --> 00:26:20,611
>> Soufan: YEAH.
ACTUALLY, I WENT THERE ONCE, ON
THE... THE FIRST ANNIVERSARY,
950
00:26:20,613 --> 00:26:21,111
ACTUALLY, I WENT THERE ONCE, ON
THE... THE FIRST ANNIVERSARY,
BUT THAT'S IT.
951
00:26:21,113 --> 00:26:21,946
THE... THE FIRST ANNIVERSARY,
BUT THAT'S IT.
>> Logan: IT'S HARD FOR ANYONE
952
00:26:21,948 --> 00:26:23,280
BUT THAT'S IT.
>> Logan: IT'S HARD FOR ANYONE
TO GO THERE, BUT... BUT...
953
00:26:23,282 --> 00:26:23,847
>> Logan: IT'S HARD FOR ANYONE
TO GO THERE, BUT... BUT...
>> Soufan: YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
954
00:26:23,849 --> 00:26:24,448
TO GO THERE, BUT... BUT...
>> Soufan: YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
>> Logan: WHY SO HARD FOR YOU,
955
00:26:24,450 --> 00:26:25,082
>> Soufan: YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
>> Logan: WHY SO HARD FOR YOU,
ALI?
956
00:26:25,084 --> 00:26:31,155
>> Logan: WHY SO HARD FOR YOU,
ALI?
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
957
00:26:31,157 --> 00:26:35,225
ALI?
>> Soufan: I DON'T KNOW.
I DON'T KNOW.
958
00:26:43,501 --> 00:26:50,207
>> Pelley: ON 9/11, DR. BENJAMIN
LUFT PREPARED STONY BROOK
UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER ON
959
00:26:50,209 --> 00:26:51,275
LUFT PREPARED STONY BROOK
UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER ON
LONG ISLAND FOR THE MASSIVE
960
00:26:51,277 --> 00:26:52,610
UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER ON
LONG ISLAND FOR THE MASSIVE
NUMBER OF CASUALTIES HE EXPECTED
961
00:26:52,612 --> 00:26:54,945
LONG ISLAND FOR THE MASSIVE
NUMBER OF CASUALTIES HE EXPECTED
TO OVERWHELM THE EMERGENCY ROOM.
962
00:26:54,947 --> 00:26:56,780
NUMBER OF CASUALTIES HE EXPECTED
TO OVERWHELM THE EMERGENCY ROOM.
BUT NONE CAME THROUGH THE DOOR
963
00:26:56,782 --> 00:26:59,917
TO OVERWHELM THE EMERGENCY ROOM.
BUT NONE CAME THROUGH THE DOOR
THAT DAY, SO FEW HAD SURVIVED.
964
00:26:59,919 --> 00:27:01,185
BUT NONE CAME THROUGH THE DOOR
THAT DAY, SO FEW HAD SURVIVED.
AS IT TURNED OUT, DR. LUFT'S
965
00:27:01,187 --> 00:27:02,686
THAT DAY, SO FEW HAD SURVIVED.
AS IT TURNED OUT, DR. LUFT'S
CASUALTIES WERE COMING, BUT THEY
966
00:27:02,688 --> 00:27:06,023
AS IT TURNED OUT, DR. LUFT'S
CASUALTIES WERE COMING, BUT THEY
WOULD ARRIVE MUCH LATER.
967
00:27:06,025 --> 00:27:09,393
CASUALTIES WERE COMING, BUT THEY
WOULD ARRIVE MUCH LATER.
ALTHOUGH NEARLY 3,000 PEOPLE
968
00:27:09,395 --> 00:27:10,561
WOULD ARRIVE MUCH LATER.
ALTHOUGH NEARLY 3,000 PEOPLE
WERE KILLED AT THE WORLD TRADE
969
00:27:10,563 --> 00:27:12,229
ALTHOUGH NEARLY 3,000 PEOPLE
WERE KILLED AT THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER, 70,000 OTHERS RESPONDED
970
00:27:12,231 --> 00:27:13,330
WERE KILLED AT THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER, 70,000 OTHERS RESPONDED
TO GROUND ZERO AND WORKED FOR
971
00:27:13,332 --> 00:27:14,398
CENTER, 70,000 OTHERS RESPONDED
TO GROUND ZERO AND WORKED FOR
MONTHS AMID TOXIC SMOKE AND
972
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,267
TO GROUND ZERO AND WORKED FOR
MONTHS AMID TOXIC SMOKE AND
DUST.
973
00:27:17,269 --> 00:27:18,936
MONTHS AMID TOXIC SMOKE AND
DUST.
DR. LUFT HELPED START A CLINIC
974
00:27:18,938 --> 00:27:19,737
DUST.
DR. LUFT HELPED START A CLINIC
TO TREAT THE CHRONIC ILLNESSES
975
00:27:19,739 --> 00:27:21,438
DR. LUFT HELPED START A CLINIC
TO TREAT THE CHRONIC ILLNESSES
AND PSYCHOLOGICAL TRAUMA
976
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,141
TO TREAT THE CHRONIC ILLNESSES
AND PSYCHOLOGICAL TRAUMA
SUFFERED BY THE 9/11 RESPONDERS.
977
00:27:24,143 --> 00:27:26,844
AND PSYCHOLOGICAL TRAUMA
SUFFERED BY THE 9/11 RESPONDERS.
OVER TIME, LUFT DISCOVERED
978
00:27:26,846 --> 00:27:28,545
SUFFERED BY THE 9/11 RESPONDERS.
OVER TIME, LUFT DISCOVERED
SOMETHING THAT HE NEVER
979
00:27:28,547 --> 00:27:31,682
OVER TIME, LUFT DISCOVERED
SOMETHING THAT HE NEVER
EXPECTED-- HE BEGAN TO HEAR
980
00:27:31,684 --> 00:27:32,983
SOMETHING THAT HE NEVER
EXPECTED-- HE BEGAN TO HEAR
THEIR STORIES; HONEST, RAW,
981
00:27:32,985 --> 00:27:34,284
EXPECTED-- HE BEGAN TO HEAR
THEIR STORIES; HONEST, RAW,
IRREPLACEABLE STORIES.
982
00:27:34,286 --> 00:27:35,619
THEIR STORIES; HONEST, RAW,
IRREPLACEABLE STORIES.
AND ALMOST TWO YEARS AGO, HE
983
00:27:35,621 --> 00:27:37,087
IRREPLACEABLE STORIES.
AND ALMOST TWO YEARS AGO, HE
BEGAN TO RECORD THE DEFINITIVE
984
00:27:37,089 --> 00:27:42,860
AND ALMOST TWO YEARS AGO, HE
BEGAN TO RECORD THE DEFINITIVE
HISTORY OF GROUND ZERO,
985
00:27:42,862 --> 00:27:43,761
BEGAN TO RECORD THE DEFINITIVE
HISTORY OF GROUND ZERO,
REMEMBERING 9/11 IN THE WORDS OF
986
00:27:43,763 --> 00:27:45,763
HISTORY OF GROUND ZERO,
REMEMBERING 9/11 IN THE WORDS OF
THE PEOPLE WHO LIVED IT.
987
00:27:45,765 --> 00:27:46,997
REMEMBERING 9/11 IN THE WORDS OF
THE PEOPLE WHO LIVED IT.
>> Dr. Benjamin Luft: THE
988
00:27:46,999 --> 00:27:48,065
THE PEOPLE WHO LIVED IT.
>> Dr. Benjamin Luft: THE
PROBLEM THAT CAME UP WAS THAT
989
00:27:48,067 --> 00:27:49,266
>> Dr. Benjamin Luft: THE
PROBLEM THAT CAME UP WAS THAT
OUR SOCIETY BEGAN TO LOOK AT THE
990
00:27:49,268 --> 00:27:49,867
PROBLEM THAT CAME UP WAS THAT
OUR SOCIETY BEGAN TO LOOK AT THE
RESPONDERS IN TERMS OF THEIR
991
00:27:49,869 --> 00:27:51,969
OUR SOCIETY BEGAN TO LOOK AT THE
RESPONDERS IN TERMS OF THEIR
DISEASE.
992
00:27:51,971 --> 00:27:54,004
RESPONDERS IN TERMS OF THEIR
DISEASE.
THEY BECAME AN ISSUE IN TERMS OF
993
00:27:54,006 --> 00:27:55,572
DISEASE.
THEY BECAME AN ISSUE IN TERMS OF
THEIR LIABILITY.
994
00:27:55,574 --> 00:27:58,442
THEY BECAME AN ISSUE IN TERMS OF
THEIR LIABILITY.
AND MY FEELING WAS THAT THAT'S
995
00:27:58,444 --> 00:27:59,610
THEIR LIABILITY.
AND MY FEELING WAS THAT THAT'S
NOT WHO THE RESPONDERS WERE.
996
00:27:59,612 --> 00:28:01,578
AND MY FEELING WAS THAT THAT'S
NOT WHO THE RESPONDERS WERE.
LET'S FIND OUT WHO THEY ARE AS
997
00:28:01,580 --> 00:28:03,447
NOT WHO THE RESPONDERS WERE.
LET'S FIND OUT WHO THEY ARE AS
HUMAN BEINGS-- WHAT THEIR
998
00:28:03,449 --> 00:28:07,084
LET'S FIND OUT WHO THEY ARE AS
HUMAN BEINGS-- WHAT THEIR
MOTIVATION WAS, WHAT VALUES THEY
999
00:28:07,086 --> 00:28:08,752
HUMAN BEINGS-- WHAT THEIR
MOTIVATION WAS, WHAT VALUES THEY
HAD, WHAT SACRIFICES THEY MADE,
1000
00:28:08,754 --> 00:28:09,953
MOTIVATION WAS, WHAT VALUES THEY
HAD, WHAT SACRIFICES THEY MADE,
HOW THEY WERE ABLE TO RENEW
1001
00:28:09,955 --> 00:28:11,488
HAD, WHAT SACRIFICES THEY MADE,
HOW THEY WERE ABLE TO RENEW
THEMSELVES.
1002
00:28:11,490 --> 00:28:12,389
HOW THEY WERE ABLE TO RENEW
THEMSELVES.
IT WAS ALMOST TAKE... LIKE
1003
00:28:12,391 --> 00:28:13,791
THEMSELVES.
IT WAS ALMOST TAKE... LIKE
TAKING A CIVICS CLASS AS TO WHAT
1004
00:28:13,793 --> 00:28:16,093
IT WAS ALMOST TAKE... LIKE
TAKING A CIVICS CLASS AS TO WHAT
IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
1005
00:28:16,095 --> 00:28:17,795
TAKING A CIVICS CLASS AS TO WHAT
IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
CITIZEN.
1006
00:28:17,797 --> 00:28:19,063
IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
CITIZEN.
WHAT IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
1007
00:28:19,065 --> 00:28:20,030
CITIZEN.
WHAT IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
HUMAN BEING?
1008
00:28:20,032 --> 00:28:21,165
WHAT IS IMPORTANT ABOUT BEING A
HUMAN BEING?
WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO BEING AN
1009
00:28:21,167 --> 00:28:23,033
HUMAN BEING?
WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO BEING AN
AMERICAN?
1010
00:28:23,035 --> 00:28:24,435
WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO BEING AN
AMERICAN?
>> Stacey Goodman: I WORKED AT
1011
00:28:24,437 --> 00:28:27,004
AMERICAN?
>> Stacey Goodman: I WORKED AT
THE MAKESHIFT MORGUE.
1012
00:28:27,006 --> 00:28:30,674
>> Stacey Goodman: I WORKED AT
THE MAKESHIFT MORGUE.
WE TOOK IN ALL THE BODIES, YOU
1013
00:28:30,676 --> 00:28:36,046
THE MAKESHIFT MORGUE.
WE TOOK IN ALL THE BODIES, YOU
KNOW?
1014
00:28:36,048 --> 00:28:38,515
WE TOOK IN ALL THE BODIES, YOU
KNOW?
SAYING, "I'M SORRY FOR YOUR
1015
00:28:38,517 --> 00:28:40,584
KNOW?
SAYING, "I'M SORRY FOR YOUR
LOSS" WAS VERY DIFFICULT,
1016
00:28:40,586 --> 00:28:42,853
SAYING, "I'M SORRY FOR YOUR
LOSS" WAS VERY DIFFICULT,
BECAUSE THAT ALMOST GOT TO BE
1017
00:28:42,855 --> 00:28:44,588
LOSS" WAS VERY DIFFICULT,
BECAUSE THAT ALMOST GOT TO BE
LIKE ROTE, YOU KNOW?
1018
00:28:44,590 --> 00:28:46,590
BECAUSE THAT ALMOST GOT TO BE
LIKE ROTE, YOU KNOW?
>> Pelley: STACEY GOODMAN, A
1019
00:28:46,592 --> 00:28:48,459
LIKE ROTE, YOU KNOW?
>> Pelley: STACEY GOODMAN, A
POLICE DETECTIVE, IS ONE OF THE
1020
00:28:48,461 --> 00:28:50,561
>> Pelley: STACEY GOODMAN, A
POLICE DETECTIVE, IS ONE OF THE
VOICES DR. LUFT RECORDED IN WHAT
1021
00:28:50,563 --> 00:28:51,228
POLICE DETECTIVE, IS ONE OF THE
VOICES DR. LUFT RECORDED IN WHAT
IS NOW CALLED THE WORLD TRADE
1022
00:28:51,230 --> 00:28:56,734
VOICES DR. LUFT RECORDED IN WHAT
IS NOW CALLED THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER ORAL HISTORY PROJECT.
1023
00:28:56,736 --> 00:28:57,334
IS NOW CALLED THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER ORAL HISTORY PROJECT.
>> Goodman: AT ONE POINT, THIS
1024
00:28:57,336 --> 00:28:58,035
CENTER ORAL HISTORY PROJECT.
>> Goodman: AT ONE POINT, THIS
SENIOR... I THINK HE WAS A
1025
00:28:58,037 --> 00:29:00,704
>> Goodman: AT ONE POINT, THIS
SENIOR... I THINK HE WAS A
RETIRED FIREMAN, HE COMES IN.
1026
00:29:00,706 --> 00:29:02,239
SENIOR... I THINK HE WAS A
RETIRED FIREMAN, HE COMES IN.
HIS HANDS ARE CUPPED.
1027
00:29:02,241 --> 00:29:06,110
RETIRED FIREMAN, HE COMES IN.
HIS HANDS ARE CUPPED.
AND HE'S GOT BONES IN HIS HANDS.
1028
00:29:06,112 --> 00:29:06,710
HIS HANDS ARE CUPPED.
AND HE'S GOT BONES IN HIS HANDS.
AND HE GOES UP TO THE MEDICAL
1029
00:29:06,712 --> 00:29:09,046
AND HE'S GOT BONES IN HIS HANDS.
AND HE GOES UP TO THE MEDICAL
EXAMINER AND HE PUTS THE BONES
1030
00:29:09,048 --> 00:29:09,680
AND HE GOES UP TO THE MEDICAL
EXAMINER AND HE PUTS THE BONES
IN FRONT OF HIM AND HE GOES,
1031
00:29:09,682 --> 00:29:16,453
EXAMINER AND HE PUTS THE BONES
IN FRONT OF HIM AND HE GOES,
"THIS IS MY SON."
1032
00:29:16,455 --> 00:29:17,588
IN FRONT OF HIM AND HE GOES,
"THIS IS MY SON."
WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THAT?
1033
00:29:17,590 --> 00:29:23,060
"THIS IS MY SON."
WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THAT?
( SNIFFS )
1034
00:29:23,062 --> 00:29:24,595
WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THAT?
( SNIFFS )
>> Pelley: NO ONE COULD POSSIBLY
1035
00:29:24,597 --> 00:29:26,196
( SNIFFS )
>> Pelley: NO ONE COULD POSSIBLY
KNOW 9/11 THE WAY THESE PEOPLE
1036
00:29:26,198 --> 00:29:27,231
>> Pelley: NO ONE COULD POSSIBLY
KNOW 9/11 THE WAY THESE PEOPLE
DO.
1037
00:29:27,233 --> 00:29:28,999
KNOW 9/11 THE WAY THESE PEOPLE
DO.
WE ASKED SEVERAL OF THE
1038
00:29:29,001 --> 00:29:29,867
DO.
WE ASKED SEVERAL OF THE
RESPONDERS TO GIVE US A SENSE OF
1039
00:29:29,869 --> 00:29:32,202
WE ASKED SEVERAL OF THE
RESPONDERS TO GIVE US A SENSE OF
THE HOURS OF TESTIMONY THAT
1040
00:29:32,204 --> 00:29:33,370
RESPONDERS TO GIVE US A SENSE OF
THE HOURS OF TESTIMONY THAT
THEY'VE PUT INTO DR. LUFT'S
1041
00:29:33,372 --> 00:29:34,271
THE HOURS OF TESTIMONY THAT
THEY'VE PUT INTO DR. LUFT'S
PROJECT.
1042
00:29:34,273 --> 00:29:35,672
THEY'VE PUT INTO DR. LUFT'S
PROJECT.
>> Carol Paukner: THE DEBRIS AND
1043
00:29:35,674 --> 00:29:38,408
PROJECT.
>> Carol Paukner: THE DEBRIS AND
THE PEOPLE RUSHING OUT AT US, I
1044
00:29:38,410 --> 00:29:39,243
>> Carol Paukner: THE DEBRIS AND
THE PEOPLE RUSHING OUT AT US, I
COULDN'T EVEN MAKE IT TO TOWER
1045
00:29:39,245 --> 00:29:40,711
THE PEOPLE RUSHING OUT AT US, I
COULDN'T EVEN MAKE IT TO TOWER
ONE.
1046
00:29:40,713 --> 00:29:41,645
COULDN'T EVEN MAKE IT TO TOWER
ONE.
I MADE IT TO THE BASE OF TOWER
1047
00:29:41,647 --> 00:29:43,013
ONE.
I MADE IT TO THE BASE OF TOWER
TWO.
1048
00:29:43,015 --> 00:29:44,481
I MADE IT TO THE BASE OF TOWER
TWO.
>> Pelley: CAROL PAUKNER WAS A
1049
00:29:44,483 --> 00:29:45,382
TWO.
>> Pelley: CAROL PAUKNER WAS A
COP, ON THE SCENE BEFORE THE
1050
00:29:45,384 --> 00:29:47,885
>> Pelley: CAROL PAUKNER WAS A
COP, ON THE SCENE BEFORE THE
TOWERS FELL.
1051
00:29:47,887 --> 00:29:51,688
COP, ON THE SCENE BEFORE THE
TOWERS FELL.
>> Paukner: THIS BIG, BRAWLY FBI
1052
00:29:51,690 --> 00:29:52,356
TOWERS FELL.
>> Paukner: THIS BIG, BRAWLY FBI
GUY HAD HIS SHIELD AROUND HIS
1053
00:29:52,358 --> 00:29:54,057
>> Paukner: THIS BIG, BRAWLY FBI
GUY HAD HIS SHIELD AROUND HIS
NECK.
1054
00:29:54,059 --> 00:29:55,025
GUY HAD HIS SHIELD AROUND HIS
NECK.
AND, YOU KNOW, I LOOKED UP AT
1055
00:29:55,027 --> 00:29:56,126
NECK.
AND, YOU KNOW, I LOOKED UP AT
HIM AND HE'S TELLING... THERE
1056
00:29:56,128 --> 00:29:58,295
AND, YOU KNOW, I LOOKED UP AT
HIM AND HE'S TELLING... THERE
WAS ABOUT SIX OFFICERS THERE
1057
00:29:58,297 --> 00:30:01,865
HIM AND HE'S TELLING... THERE
WAS ABOUT SIX OFFICERS THERE
WITH ME, AND HE'S LIKE, "IF YOU
1058
00:30:01,867 --> 00:30:02,466
WAS ABOUT SIX OFFICERS THERE
WITH ME, AND HE'S LIKE, "IF YOU
WANT TO LIVE, YOU... YOU MIGHT
1059
00:30:02,468 --> 00:30:03,967
WITH ME, AND HE'S LIKE, "IF YOU
WANT TO LIVE, YOU... YOU MIGHT
AS WELL LEAVE NOW."
1060
00:30:03,969 --> 00:30:05,302
WANT TO LIVE, YOU... YOU MIGHT
AS WELL LEAVE NOW."
HE SAID, "WE'RE ALL GOING TO
1061
00:30:05,304 --> 00:30:07,070
AS WELL LEAVE NOW."
HE SAID, "WE'RE ALL GOING TO
DIE."
1062
00:30:07,072 --> 00:30:07,738
HE SAID, "WE'RE ALL GOING TO
DIE."
AND I'M LIKE, "I CAN'T... WE
1063
00:30:07,740 --> 00:30:08,739
DIE."
AND I'M LIKE, "I CAN'T... WE
CAN'T LEAVE.
1064
00:30:08,741 --> 00:30:10,574
AND I'M LIKE, "I CAN'T... WE
CAN'T LEAVE.
I'M... I'M NOT LEAVING."
1065
00:30:10,576 --> 00:30:11,775
CAN'T LEAVE.
I'M... I'M NOT LEAVING."
AND THE OFFICERS THAT I WERE
1066
00:30:11,777 --> 00:30:13,443
I'M... I'M NOT LEAVING."
AND THE OFFICERS THAT I WERE
THERE WITH, "WE'RE NOT LEAVING,
1067
00:30:13,445 --> 00:30:14,111
AND THE OFFICERS THAT I WERE
THERE WITH, "WE'RE NOT LEAVING,
EITHER."
1068
00:30:14,113 --> 00:30:16,180
THERE WITH, "WE'RE NOT LEAVING,
EITHER."
AND WE CONTINUED TO EVACUATE AND
1069
00:30:16,182 --> 00:30:18,715
EITHER."
AND WE CONTINUED TO EVACUATE AND
DO OUR JOBS BUT, YOU KNOW, WE
1070
00:30:18,717 --> 00:30:19,416
AND WE CONTINUED TO EVACUATE AND
DO OUR JOBS BUT, YOU KNOW, WE
WERE ALL LIKE, "WOW, WE'RE GOING
1071
00:30:19,418 --> 00:30:21,285
DO OUR JOBS BUT, YOU KNOW, WE
WERE ALL LIKE, "WOW, WE'RE GOING
TO DIE," YOU KNOW?
1072
00:30:21,287 --> 00:30:22,953
WERE ALL LIKE, "WOW, WE'RE GOING
TO DIE," YOU KNOW?
>> Pelley: PAUKNER WAS TRAPPED
1073
00:30:22,955 --> 00:30:25,355
TO DIE," YOU KNOW?
>> Pelley: PAUKNER WAS TRAPPED
WHEN THE FIRST TOWER COLLAPSED.
1074
00:30:25,357 --> 00:30:26,323
>> Pelley: PAUKNER WAS TRAPPED
WHEN THE FIRST TOWER COLLAPSED.
THAT'S HER, ON THE LEFT, AFTER
1075
00:30:26,325 --> 00:30:27,257
WHEN THE FIRST TOWER COLLAPSED.
THAT'S HER, ON THE LEFT, AFTER
SHE PULLED HERSELF OUT OF THE
1076
00:30:27,259 --> 00:30:30,661
THAT'S HER, ON THE LEFT, AFTER
SHE PULLED HERSELF OUT OF THE
WRECKAGE.
1077
00:30:30,663 --> 00:30:31,495
SHE PULLED HERSELF OUT OF THE
WRECKAGE.
SHE'S WITH A FELLOW COP AND A
1078
00:30:31,497 --> 00:30:32,162
WRECKAGE.
SHE'S WITH A FELLOW COP AND A
WOMAN THAT THEY RESCUED.
1079
00:30:32,164 --> 00:30:33,096
SHE'S WITH A FELLOW COP AND A
WOMAN THAT THEY RESCUED.
>> Richard Doerler: I WAS ONE OF
1080
00:30:33,098 --> 00:30:34,498
WOMAN THAT THEY RESCUED.
>> Richard Doerler: I WAS ONE OF
THE GUYS WHO WAS ABLE TO PULL
1081
00:30:34,500 --> 00:30:35,933
>> Richard Doerler: I WAS ONE OF
THE GUYS WHO WAS ABLE TO PULL
SOMEONE OUT ALIVE.
1082
00:30:35,935 --> 00:30:36,967
THE GUYS WHO WAS ABLE TO PULL
SOMEONE OUT ALIVE.
>> Pelley: SO FEW WERE SAVED,
1083
00:30:36,969 --> 00:30:38,035
SOMEONE OUT ALIVE.
>> Pelley: SO FEW WERE SAVED,
BUT POLICE SERGEANT RICHARD
1084
00:30:38,037 --> 00:30:40,270
>> Pelley: SO FEW WERE SAVED,
BUT POLICE SERGEANT RICHARD
DOERLER HELPED PULL OUT ONE RARE
1085
00:30:40,272 --> 00:30:42,272
BUT POLICE SERGEANT RICHARD
DOERLER HELPED PULL OUT ONE RARE
SURVIVOR, A FELLOW COP NAMED
1086
00:30:42,274 --> 00:30:42,806
DOERLER HELPED PULL OUT ONE RARE
SURVIVOR, A FELLOW COP NAMED
JOHN McLOUGHLIN.
1087
00:30:42,808 --> 00:30:44,408
SURVIVOR, A FELLOW COP NAMED
JOHN McLOUGHLIN.
>> Doerler: THEY WERE GIVING...
1088
00:30:44,410 --> 00:30:47,277
JOHN McLOUGHLIN.
>> Doerler: THEY WERE GIVING...
JOHN WAS... GIVING JOHN
1089
00:30:47,279 --> 00:30:49,046
>> Doerler: THEY WERE GIVING...
JOHN WAS... GIVING JOHN
McLOUGHLIN MORPHINE BECAUSE
1090
00:30:49,048 --> 00:30:51,849
JOHN WAS... GIVING JOHN
McLOUGHLIN MORPHINE BECAUSE
THE... THE PLAN WAS THAT, IF WE
1091
00:30:51,851 --> 00:30:52,416
McLOUGHLIN MORPHINE BECAUSE
THE... THE PLAN WAS THAT, IF WE
COULDN'T EXTRICATE HIM, THEY
1092
00:30:52,418 --> 00:30:55,619
THE... THE PLAN WAS THAT, IF WE
COULDN'T EXTRICATE HIM, THEY
WERE GOING TO CUT HIS LEGS OFF.
1093
00:30:55,621 --> 00:30:57,187
COULDN'T EXTRICATE HIM, THEY
WERE GOING TO CUT HIS LEGS OFF.
JOHN SCREAMED IN PAIN WHILE WE
1094
00:30:57,189 --> 00:30:59,656
WERE GOING TO CUT HIS LEGS OFF.
JOHN SCREAMED IN PAIN WHILE WE
PULLED HIM, INITIALLY, SO WE LET
1095
00:30:59,658 --> 00:31:03,794
JOHN SCREAMED IN PAIN WHILE WE
PULLED HIM, INITIALLY, SO WE LET
HIM REST.
1096
00:31:03,796 --> 00:31:04,428
PULLED HIM, INITIALLY, SO WE LET
HIM REST.
AND WE SIMULTANEOUSLY PULLED
1097
00:31:04,430 --> 00:31:05,529
HIM REST.
AND WE SIMULTANEOUSLY PULLED
AGAIN AND WE BROKE HIM FREE AND
1098
00:31:05,531 --> 00:31:14,504
AND WE SIMULTANEOUSLY PULLED
AGAIN AND WE BROKE HIM FREE AND
PULLED HIM OUT.
1099
00:31:14,506 --> 00:31:16,473
AGAIN AND WE BROKE HIM FREE AND
PULLED HIM OUT.
>> Luft: WANT YOU TAKE SOME NICE
1100
00:31:16,475 --> 00:31:17,975
PULLED HIM OUT.
>> Luft: WANT YOU TAKE SOME NICE
DEEP BREATHS.
1101
00:31:17,977 --> 00:31:19,576
>> Luft: WANT YOU TAKE SOME NICE
DEEP BREATHS.
>> Pelley: BENJAMIN LUFT IS A
1102
00:31:19,578 --> 00:31:21,578
DEEP BREATHS.
>> Pelley: BENJAMIN LUFT IS A
MEDICAL DOCTOR WHO VOLUNTEERED
1103
00:31:21,580 --> 00:31:22,880
>> Pelley: BENJAMIN LUFT IS A
MEDICAL DOCTOR WHO VOLUNTEERED
TO HELP CREATE A CLINIC FOR THE
1104
00:31:22,882 --> 00:31:26,350
MEDICAL DOCTOR WHO VOLUNTEERED
TO HELP CREATE A CLINIC FOR THE
9/11 RESPONDERS AT STONY BROOK
1105
00:31:26,352 --> 00:31:27,150
TO HELP CREATE A CLINIC FOR THE
9/11 RESPONDERS AT STONY BROOK
UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER, PART
1106
00:31:27,152 --> 00:31:27,751
9/11 RESPONDERS AT STONY BROOK
UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER, PART
OF THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF NEW
1107
00:31:27,753 --> 00:31:29,253
UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER, PART
OF THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF NEW
YORK.
1108
00:31:29,255 --> 00:31:30,821
OF THE STATE UNIVERSITY OF NEW
YORK.
MORE THAN 6,000 RESPONDERS
1109
00:31:30,823 --> 00:31:32,322
YORK.
MORE THAN 6,000 RESPONDERS
ENROLLED IN HIS WORLD TRADE
1110
00:31:32,324 --> 00:31:35,425
MORE THAN 6,000 RESPONDERS
ENROLLED IN HIS WORLD TRADE
CENTER HEALTH PROGRAM.
1111
00:31:35,427 --> 00:31:36,593
ENROLLED IN HIS WORLD TRADE
CENTER HEALTH PROGRAM.
ONE STUDY SHOWS THAT NEARLY A
1112
00:31:36,595 --> 00:31:38,195
CENTER HEALTH PROGRAM.
ONE STUDY SHOWS THAT NEARLY A
THIRD OF THOSE WHO WORKED AT
1113
00:31:38,197 --> 00:31:41,598
ONE STUDY SHOWS THAT NEARLY A
THIRD OF THOSE WHO WORKED AT
GROUND ZERO HAVE ASTHMA, 42%
1114
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:42,866
THIRD OF THOSE WHO WORKED AT
GROUND ZERO HAVE ASTHMA, 42%
SUFFER WITH SINUSITIS, NEARLY
1115
00:31:42,935 --> 00:31:48,272
GROUND ZERO HAVE ASTHMA, 42%
SUFFER WITH SINUSITIS, NEARLY
40% HAVE GASTRO-ESOPHAGEAL
1116
00:31:48,274 --> 00:31:50,407
SUFFER WITH SINUSITIS, NEARLY
40% HAVE GASTRO-ESOPHAGEAL
REFLUX DISEASE, KNOWN AS "GERD";
1117
00:31:50,409 --> 00:31:51,208
40% HAVE GASTRO-ESOPHAGEAL
REFLUX DISEASE, KNOWN AS "GERD";
AND MANY HAVE REACTIVE AIRWAYS
1118
00:31:51,210 --> 00:31:52,676
REFLUX DISEASE, KNOWN AS "GERD";
AND MANY HAVE REACTIVE AIRWAYS
DYSFUNCTION SYNDROME THAT THE
1119
00:31:52,678 --> 00:31:55,379
AND MANY HAVE REACTIVE AIRWAYS
DYSFUNCTION SYNDROME THAT THE
PATIENTS JUST CALL "RADS."
1120
00:31:55,381 --> 00:31:57,147
DYSFUNCTION SYNDROME THAT THE
PATIENTS JUST CALL "RADS."
>> Luft: WHEN YOU'RE A PHYSICIAN
1121
00:31:57,149 --> 00:31:58,782
PATIENTS JUST CALL "RADS."
>> Luft: WHEN YOU'RE A PHYSICIAN
AND YOU SEE PATIENTS, YOU TEND
1122
00:31:58,784 --> 00:32:00,784
>> Luft: WHEN YOU'RE A PHYSICIAN
AND YOU SEE PATIENTS, YOU TEND
TO REDUCE THEM TO THEIR SYMPTOMS
1123
00:32:00,786 --> 00:32:02,119
AND YOU SEE PATIENTS, YOU TEND
TO REDUCE THEM TO THEIR SYMPTOMS
AND SIGNS, TO THEIR MEDICAL
1124
00:32:02,121 --> 00:32:03,353
TO REDUCE THEM TO THEIR SYMPTOMS
AND SIGNS, TO THEIR MEDICAL
CONDITIONS.
1125
00:32:03,355 --> 00:32:04,488
AND SIGNS, TO THEIR MEDICAL
CONDITIONS.
AND THAT'S HOW YOU THINK OF
1126
00:32:04,490 --> 00:32:04,988
CONDITIONS.
AND THAT'S HOW YOU THINK OF
THEM.
1127
00:32:04,990 --> 00:32:06,023
AND THAT'S HOW YOU THINK OF
THEM.
>> Pelley: LUFT LISTENED TO
1128
00:32:06,025 --> 00:32:06,890
THEM.
>> Pelley: LUFT LISTENED TO
THEIR STORIES IN THE EXAMINING
1129
00:32:06,892 --> 00:32:10,494
>> Pelley: LUFT LISTENED TO
THEIR STORIES IN THE EXAMINING
ROOM FOR EIGHT YEARS WHEN HE
1130
00:32:10,496 --> 00:32:11,762
THEIR STORIES IN THE EXAMINING
ROOM FOR EIGHT YEARS WHEN HE
REALIZED THAT HIS PATIENTS WERE
1131
00:32:11,764 --> 00:32:13,830
ROOM FOR EIGHT YEARS WHEN HE
REALIZED THAT HIS PATIENTS WERE
THE AUTHORS OF ONE OF THE MOST
1132
00:32:13,832 --> 00:32:14,798
REALIZED THAT HIS PATIENTS WERE
THE AUTHORS OF ONE OF THE MOST
DRAMATIC CHAPTERS OF AMERICAN
1133
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,200
THE AUTHORS OF ONE OF THE MOST
DRAMATIC CHAPTERS OF AMERICAN
HISTORY.
1134
00:32:17,202 --> 00:32:18,068
DRAMATIC CHAPTERS OF AMERICAN
HISTORY.
>> Luft: YOUR STORY OF WHAT
1135
00:32:18,070 --> 00:32:20,037
HISTORY.
>> Luft: YOUR STORY OF WHAT
HAPPENED ON 9/11.
1136
00:32:20,039 --> 00:32:21,505
>> Luft: YOUR STORY OF WHAT
HAPPENED ON 9/11.
>> SHE BECAME HYSTERICAL.
1137
00:32:21,507 --> 00:32:22,105
HAPPENED ON 9/11.
>> SHE BECAME HYSTERICAL.
SHE GOT A CELL PHONE CALL THAT
1138
00:32:22,107 --> 00:32:24,875
>> SHE BECAME HYSTERICAL.
SHE GOT A CELL PHONE CALL THAT
HER... THAT THE TRADE CENTER WAS
1139
00:32:24,877 --> 00:32:26,944
SHE GOT A CELL PHONE CALL THAT
HER... THAT THE TRADE CENTER WAS
HIT WITH A PLANE.
1140
00:32:26,946 --> 00:32:28,011
HER... THAT THE TRADE CENTER WAS
HIT WITH A PLANE.
>> Pelley: WITH HIS OWN MONEY, A
1141
00:32:28,013 --> 00:32:29,146
HIT WITH A PLANE.
>> Pelley: WITH HIS OWN MONEY, A
FEW DONATIONS, AND A SMALL,
1142
00:32:29,148 --> 00:32:31,381
>> Pelley: WITH HIS OWN MONEY, A
FEW DONATIONS, AND A SMALL,
MOSTLY VOLUNTEER STAFF, LUFT
1143
00:32:31,383 --> 00:32:33,383
FEW DONATIONS, AND A SMALL,
MOSTLY VOLUNTEER STAFF, LUFT
STARTED HIS INTERVIEWS.
1144
00:32:33,385 --> 00:32:35,485
MOSTLY VOLUNTEER STAFF, LUFT
STARTED HIS INTERVIEWS.
SO FAR, HE'S RECORDED 137.
1145
00:32:35,487 --> 00:32:41,058
STARTED HIS INTERVIEWS.
SO FAR, HE'S RECORDED 137.
>> Paukner: WHEN THE BUILDING
1146
00:32:41,060 --> 00:32:42,559
SO FAR, HE'S RECORDED 137.
>> Paukner: WHEN THE BUILDING
IMPLODED DOWN, IT BLEW ME OUT OF
1147
00:32:42,561 --> 00:32:44,294
>> Paukner: WHEN THE BUILDING
IMPLODED DOWN, IT BLEW ME OUT OF
THE BUILDING, AND I WAS ABLE TO
1148
00:32:44,296 --> 00:32:46,096
IMPLODED DOWN, IT BLEW ME OUT OF
THE BUILDING, AND I WAS ABLE TO
HOLD ONTO THE DOORWAY WITH MY
1149
00:32:46,098 --> 00:32:48,365
THE BUILDING, AND I WAS ABLE TO
HOLD ONTO THE DOORWAY WITH MY
LEFT ARM.
1150
00:32:48,367 --> 00:32:50,334
HOLD ONTO THE DOORWAY WITH MY
LEFT ARM.
>> Christine Famiglietti: THE
1151
00:32:50,336 --> 00:32:52,436
LEFT ARM.
>> Christine Famiglietti: THE
FIRST THING I FOUND WAS AN
1152
00:32:52,438 --> 00:32:55,572
>> Christine Famiglietti: THE
FIRST THING I FOUND WAS AN
ENTIRE BODY, BURNED INTO REBAR.
1153
00:32:55,574 --> 00:32:56,440
FIRST THING I FOUND WAS AN
ENTIRE BODY, BURNED INTO REBAR.
>> Bill Fischer: THEY... THEY
1154
00:32:56,442 --> 00:32:57,975
ENTIRE BODY, BURNED INTO REBAR.
>> Bill Fischer: THEY... THEY
PUT A LINE AROUND OUR WAIST.
1155
00:32:57,977 --> 00:32:59,443
>> Bill Fischer: THEY... THEY
PUT A LINE AROUND OUR WAIST.
I'M LIKE, "I'M GOING IN THIS
1156
00:32:59,445 --> 00:33:00,644
PUT A LINE AROUND OUR WAIST.
I'M LIKE, "I'M GOING IN THIS
WAY, SNAKING AROUND ON MY BELLY
1157
00:33:00,646 --> 00:33:01,345
I'M LIKE, "I'M GOING IN THIS
WAY, SNAKING AROUND ON MY BELLY
AROUND," SAYS, "THERE'S NO WAY
1158
00:33:01,347 --> 00:33:03,146
WAY, SNAKING AROUND ON MY BELLY
AROUND," SAYS, "THERE'S NO WAY
YOU CAN PULL ME OUT."
1159
00:33:03,148 --> 00:33:04,848
AROUND," SAYS, "THERE'S NO WAY
YOU CAN PULL ME OUT."
AND THE GUY JUST LOOKED AT ME.
1160
00:33:04,850 --> 00:33:07,250
YOU CAN PULL ME OUT."
AND THE GUY JUST LOOKED AT ME.
IT WASN'T TO PULL US OUT; IT WAS
1161
00:33:07,252 --> 00:33:11,054
AND THE GUY JUST LOOKED AT ME.
IT WASN'T TO PULL US OUT; IT WAS
JUST TO FIND US IF WE DIED.
1162
00:33:11,056 --> 00:33:12,522
IT WASN'T TO PULL US OUT; IT WAS
JUST TO FIND US IF WE DIED.
>> WHERE WE EXPECTED TO SEE TWO
1163
00:33:12,524 --> 00:33:13,156
JUST TO FIND US IF WE DIED.
>> WHERE WE EXPECTED TO SEE TWO
TALL BUILDINGS, WE JUST SAW A
1164
00:33:13,158 --> 00:33:17,260
>> WHERE WE EXPECTED TO SEE TWO
TALL BUILDINGS, WE JUST SAW A
SKELETON.
1165
00:33:17,262 --> 00:33:19,963
TALL BUILDINGS, WE JUST SAW A
SKELETON.
THE MOST POWERFUL NATION IN THE
1166
00:33:19,965 --> 00:33:20,430
SKELETON.
THE MOST POWERFUL NATION IN THE
WORLD.
1167
00:33:20,432 --> 00:33:23,066
THE MOST POWERFUL NATION IN THE
WORLD.
HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN?
1168
00:33:23,068 --> 00:33:24,101
WORLD.
HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN?
>> Luft: THERE'S NO CLEARER
1169
00:33:24,103 --> 00:33:25,669
HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN?
>> Luft: THERE'S NO CLEARER
RENDITION OF WHAT HAPPENED ON
1170
00:33:25,671 --> 00:33:26,403
>> Luft: THERE'S NO CLEARER
RENDITION OF WHAT HAPPENED ON
9/11 THAN THERE ARE IN THESE
1171
00:33:26,405 --> 00:33:27,871
RENDITION OF WHAT HAPPENED ON
9/11 THAN THERE ARE IN THESE
HISTORIES.
1172
00:33:27,873 --> 00:33:29,272
9/11 THAN THERE ARE IN THESE
HISTORIES.
>> Pelley: WHO ARE THESE PEOPLE?
1173
00:33:29,274 --> 00:33:30,707
HISTORIES.
>> Pelley: WHO ARE THESE PEOPLE?
>> Luft: SO, OF COURSE, WE HAVE
1174
00:33:30,709 --> 00:33:34,244
>> Pelley: WHO ARE THESE PEOPLE?
>> Luft: SO, OF COURSE, WE HAVE
THE FIREMEN AND THE POLICEMEN
1175
00:33:34,246 --> 00:33:35,012
>> Luft: SO, OF COURSE, WE HAVE
THE FIREMEN AND THE POLICEMEN
AND THE E.M.S. WORKERS.
1176
00:33:35,014 --> 00:33:35,645
THE FIREMEN AND THE POLICEMEN
AND THE E.M.S. WORKERS.
AND THEN, WE HAVE THE VOLUNTEER
1177
00:33:35,647 --> 00:33:36,947
AND THE E.M.S. WORKERS.
AND THEN, WE HAVE THE VOLUNTEER
FIREMEN.
1178
00:33:36,949 --> 00:33:38,048
AND THEN, WE HAVE THE VOLUNTEER
FIREMEN.
AND THEN, YOU HAVE THE
1179
00:33:38,050 --> 00:33:39,082
FIREMEN.
AND THEN, YOU HAVE THE
IRONWORKERS AND THE CONSTRUCTION
1180
00:33:39,084 --> 00:33:41,752
AND THEN, YOU HAVE THE
IRONWORKERS AND THE CONSTRUCTION
WORKERS AND THE LABORERS.
1181
00:33:41,754 --> 00:33:44,888
IRONWORKERS AND THE CONSTRUCTION
WORKERS AND THE LABORERS.
ON 9/11, ALL AMERICANS
1182
00:33:44,890 --> 00:33:45,722
WORKERS AND THE LABORERS.
ON 9/11, ALL AMERICANS
RESPONDED, FROM ALL WALKS OF
1183
00:33:45,724 --> 00:33:47,591
ON 9/11, ALL AMERICANS
RESPONDED, FROM ALL WALKS OF
LIFE.
1184
00:33:47,593 --> 00:33:48,325
RESPONDED, FROM ALL WALKS OF
LIFE.
>> I WAS A SENIOR IN HIGH
1185
00:33:48,327 --> 00:33:49,726
LIFE.
>> I WAS A SENIOR IN HIGH
SCHOOL.
1186
00:33:49,728 --> 00:33:51,028
>> I WAS A SENIOR IN HIGH
SCHOOL.
I REALIZED I HAD TO GO DOWN
1187
00:33:51,030 --> 00:33:53,597
SCHOOL.
I REALIZED I HAD TO GO DOWN
THERE.
1188
00:33:53,599 --> 00:33:54,297
I REALIZED I HAD TO GO DOWN
THERE.
I DON'T KNOW HOW I'M GOING TO
1189
00:33:54,299 --> 00:33:54,998
THERE.
I DON'T KNOW HOW I'M GOING TO
HELP; I DON'T KNOW WHAT I CAN
1190
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,067
I DON'T KNOW HOW I'M GOING TO
HELP; I DON'T KNOW WHAT I CAN
DO.
1191
00:33:57,069 --> 00:33:59,436
HELP; I DON'T KNOW WHAT I CAN
DO.
>> MY WHOLE FAMILY IS COPS.
1192
00:33:59,438 --> 00:34:01,405
DO.
>> MY WHOLE FAMILY IS COPS.
I'M THE 13TH IN MY FAMILY BEING
1193
00:34:01,407 --> 00:34:04,608
>> MY WHOLE FAMILY IS COPS.
I'M THE 13TH IN MY FAMILY BEING
A NEW YORK CITY POLICE OFFICER.
1194
00:34:04,610 --> 00:34:05,175
I'M THE 13TH IN MY FAMILY BEING
A NEW YORK CITY POLICE OFFICER.
>> I AM A LICENSED MASSAGE
1195
00:34:05,177 --> 00:34:06,076
A NEW YORK CITY POLICE OFFICER.
>> I AM A LICENSED MASSAGE
THERAPIST.
1196
00:34:06,078 --> 00:34:08,712
>> I AM A LICENSED MASSAGE
THERAPIST.
I JUST FELT LIKE I HAD TO BE
1197
00:34:08,714 --> 00:34:11,114
THERAPIST.
I JUST FELT LIKE I HAD TO BE
DOWN THERE HELPING THESE PEOPLE,
1198
00:34:11,116 --> 00:34:12,215
I JUST FELT LIKE I HAD TO BE
DOWN THERE HELPING THESE PEOPLE,
KNOWING WHAT I DO FOR A LIVING
1199
00:34:12,217 --> 00:34:16,386
DOWN THERE HELPING THESE PEOPLE,
KNOWING WHAT I DO FOR A LIVING
CAN HELP THESE PEOPLE.
1200
00:34:16,388 --> 00:34:17,087
KNOWING WHAT I DO FOR A LIVING
CAN HELP THESE PEOPLE.
>> I WORK FOR THE N.Y.C. HIGHWAY
1201
00:34:17,089 --> 00:34:17,554
CAN HELP THESE PEOPLE.
>> I WORK FOR THE N.Y.C. HIGHWAY
DEPT.
1202
00:34:17,556 --> 00:34:18,088
>> I WORK FOR THE N.Y.C. HIGHWAY
DEPT.
I.... YOU KNOW, ROADWORK,
1203
00:34:18,090 --> 00:34:18,688
DEPT.
I.... YOU KNOW, ROADWORK,
CONSTRUCTION, STUFF LIKE THAT.
1204
00:34:18,690 --> 00:34:19,256
I.... YOU KNOW, ROADWORK,
CONSTRUCTION, STUFF LIKE THAT.
I NEVER TRAINED FOR ANYTHING
1205
00:34:19,258 --> 00:34:20,190
CONSTRUCTION, STUFF LIKE THAT.
I NEVER TRAINED FOR ANYTHING
LIKE THIS.
1206
00:34:20,192 --> 00:34:24,227
I NEVER TRAINED FOR ANYTHING
LIKE THIS.
AND I LEARNED QUICK, THOUGH.
1207
00:34:24,229 --> 00:34:24,861
LIKE THIS.
AND I LEARNED QUICK, THOUGH.
>> Pelley: WE SPENT A FEW HOURS
1208
00:34:24,863 --> 00:34:25,462
AND I LEARNED QUICK, THOUGH.
>> Pelley: WE SPENT A FEW HOURS
WITH SOME OF THE RESPONDERS AT
1209
00:34:25,464 --> 00:34:28,799
>> Pelley: WE SPENT A FEW HOURS
WITH SOME OF THE RESPONDERS AT
STONY BROOK UNIVERSITY.
1210
00:34:28,801 --> 00:34:30,467
WITH SOME OF THE RESPONDERS AT
STONY BROOK UNIVERSITY.
AND AS WE LISTENED, WE REALIZED
1211
00:34:30,469 --> 00:34:32,235
STONY BROOK UNIVERSITY.
AND AS WE LISTENED, WE REALIZED
THAT, FOR THEM, TODAY, SUNDAY,
1212
00:34:32,237 --> 00:34:34,104
AND AS WE LISTENED, WE REALIZED
THAT, FOR THEM, TODAY, SUNDAY,
ISN'T THE TENTH ANNIVERSARY OF
1213
00:34:34,106 --> 00:34:36,640
THAT, FOR THEM, TODAY, SUNDAY,
ISN'T THE TENTH ANNIVERSARY OF
SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED; IT'S
1214
00:34:36,642 --> 00:34:37,340
ISN'T THE TENTH ANNIVERSARY OF
SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED; IT'S
THE TENTH YEAR OF SOMETHING THAT
1215
00:34:37,342 --> 00:34:38,575
SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED; IT'S
THE TENTH YEAR OF SOMETHING THAT
NEVER ENDS.
1216
00:34:38,577 --> 00:34:41,411
THE TENTH YEAR OF SOMETHING THAT
NEVER ENDS.
IN A SENSE, IT'S ALWAYS 9/11.
1217
00:34:41,413 --> 00:34:43,280
NEVER ENDS.
IN A SENSE, IT'S ALWAYS 9/11.
JOHN GALLAGHER IS A FORMER NEW
1218
00:34:43,282 --> 00:34:44,681
IN A SENSE, IT'S ALWAYS 9/11.
JOHN GALLAGHER IS A FORMER NEW
YORK CITY FIRE CAPTAIN SUFFERING
1219
00:34:44,683 --> 00:34:47,117
JOHN GALLAGHER IS A FORMER NEW
YORK CITY FIRE CAPTAIN SUFFERING
WITH PULMONARY FIBROSIS,
1220
00:34:47,119 --> 00:34:48,618
YORK CITY FIRE CAPTAIN SUFFERING
WITH PULMONARY FIBROSIS,
SCARRING OF THE LUNGS THAT ONLY
1221
00:34:48,620 --> 00:34:50,387
WITH PULMONARY FIBROSIS,
SCARRING OF THE LUNGS THAT ONLY
GETS WORSE.
1222
00:34:50,389 --> 00:34:52,923
SCARRING OF THE LUNGS THAT ONLY
GETS WORSE.
>> John Gallagher: THE WORLD
1223
00:34:52,925 --> 00:34:53,523
GETS WORSE.
>> John Gallagher: THE WORLD
TRADE CENTER IS STILL CLAIMING
1224
00:34:53,525 --> 00:34:56,326
>> John Gallagher: THE WORLD
TRADE CENTER IS STILL CLAIMING
LIVES.
1225
00:34:56,328 --> 00:34:57,327
TRADE CENTER IS STILL CLAIMING
LIVES.
PEOPLE HAVE HAD THEIR LIVES
1226
00:34:57,329 --> 00:35:00,330
LIVES.
PEOPLE HAVE HAD THEIR LIVES
SHORTENED.
1227
00:35:00,332 --> 00:35:01,031
PEOPLE HAVE HAD THEIR LIVES
SHORTENED.
PEOPLE HAVE LOST THEIR FATHERS,
1228
00:35:01,033 --> 00:35:02,632
SHORTENED.
PEOPLE HAVE LOST THEIR FATHERS,
THEIR... THEIR MOTHERS TO
1229
00:35:02,634 --> 00:35:06,570
PEOPLE HAVE LOST THEIR FATHERS,
THEIR... THEIR MOTHERS TO
CANCERS, TO LUNG DISEASES,
1230
00:35:06,572 --> 00:35:07,604
THEIR... THEIR MOTHERS TO
CANCERS, TO LUNG DISEASES,
ANYTHING THAT YOU CAN IMAGINE,
1231
00:35:07,606 --> 00:35:09,372
CANCERS, TO LUNG DISEASES,
ANYTHING THAT YOU CAN IMAGINE,
BLOOD-BORNE DISEASES.
1232
00:35:09,374 --> 00:35:13,677
ANYTHING THAT YOU CAN IMAGINE,
BLOOD-BORNE DISEASES.
PEOPLE ARE STILL DYING.
1233
00:35:13,679 --> 00:35:14,978
BLOOD-BORNE DISEASES.
PEOPLE ARE STILL DYING.
>> Pelley: SHOW OF HANDS.
1234
00:35:14,980 --> 00:35:15,612
PEOPLE ARE STILL DYING.
>> Pelley: SHOW OF HANDS.
HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE BEEN LIVING
1235
00:35:15,614 --> 00:35:16,646
>> Pelley: SHOW OF HANDS.
HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE BEEN LIVING
THROUGH MEDICAL PROBLEMS AS A
1236
00:35:16,648 --> 00:35:18,415
HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE BEEN LIVING
THROUGH MEDICAL PROBLEMS AS A
RESULT OF THE WORK THAT YOU DID
1237
00:35:18,417 --> 00:35:22,919
THROUGH MEDICAL PROBLEMS AS A
RESULT OF THE WORK THAT YOU DID
IN THOSE DAYS?
1238
00:35:22,921 --> 00:35:24,488
RESULT OF THE WORK THAT YOU DID
IN THOSE DAYS?
ALMOST ALL OF YOU.
1239
00:35:24,490 --> 00:35:26,323
IN THOSE DAYS?
ALMOST ALL OF YOU.
BILL, GIVE ME A SENSE OF WHAT
1240
00:35:26,325 --> 00:35:26,890
ALMOST ALL OF YOU.
BILL, GIVE ME A SENSE OF WHAT
YOU'VE BEEN WORKING THROUGH,
1241
00:35:26,892 --> 00:35:30,760
BILL, GIVE ME A SENSE OF WHAT
YOU'VE BEEN WORKING THROUGH,
HEALTH-WISE.
1242
00:35:30,762 --> 00:35:32,229
YOU'VE BEEN WORKING THROUGH,
HEALTH-WISE.
>> Fischer: I HAVE ASTHMA, I
1243
00:35:32,231 --> 00:35:35,031
HEALTH-WISE.
>> Fischer: I HAVE ASTHMA, I
HAVE NODULES ON BOTH LUNGS,
1244
00:35:35,033 --> 00:35:37,434
>> Fischer: I HAVE ASTHMA, I
HAVE NODULES ON BOTH LUNGS,
SINUSITIS, RHINITIS.
1245
00:35:37,436 --> 00:35:39,936
HAVE NODULES ON BOTH LUNGS,
SINUSITIS, RHINITIS.
>> Pelley: BILL FISCHER WAS A
1246
00:35:39,938 --> 00:35:41,271
SINUSITIS, RHINITIS.
>> Pelley: BILL FISCHER WAS A
NEW YORK CITY COP, NOW RETIRED.
1247
00:35:41,273 --> 00:35:42,305
>> Pelley: BILL FISCHER WAS A
NEW YORK CITY COP, NOW RETIRED.
>> Fischer: I... I NEVER SMOKED,
1248
00:35:42,307 --> 00:35:44,574
NEW YORK CITY COP, NOW RETIRED.
>> Fischer: I... I NEVER SMOKED,
I DON'T DRINK.
1249
00:35:44,576 --> 00:35:47,844
>> Fischer: I... I NEVER SMOKED,
I DON'T DRINK.
I'M... I GO THE GYM AS OFTEN AS
1250
00:35:47,846 --> 00:35:48,545
I DON'T DRINK.
I'M... I GO THE GYM AS OFTEN AS
I CAN, AND IT'S NOT AS MUCH AS I
1251
00:35:48,547 --> 00:35:49,646
I'M... I GO THE GYM AS OFTEN AS
I CAN, AND IT'S NOT AS MUCH AS I
WOULD LIKE TO ANYMORE.
1252
00:35:49,648 --> 00:35:51,748
I CAN, AND IT'S NOT AS MUCH AS I
WOULD LIKE TO ANYMORE.
I LITERALLY HAVE A BUCKET OF
1253
00:35:51,750 --> 00:35:54,751
WOULD LIKE TO ANYMORE.
I LITERALLY HAVE A BUCKET OF
ABOUT 20 MEDICINES, A PLASTIC
1254
00:35:54,753 --> 00:35:55,652
I LITERALLY HAVE A BUCKET OF
ABOUT 20 MEDICINES, A PLASTIC
BUCKET THAT I HAVE TO TAKE
1255
00:35:55,654 --> 00:35:57,521
ABOUT 20 MEDICINES, A PLASTIC
BUCKET THAT I HAVE TO TAKE
SOMETHING DURING THE DAY.
1256
00:35:57,523 --> 00:36:00,657
BUCKET THAT I HAVE TO TAKE
SOMETHING DURING THE DAY.
>> Pelley: THIS IS BILL FISCHER.
1257
00:36:00,659 --> 00:36:01,491
SOMETHING DURING THE DAY.
>> Pelley: THIS IS BILL FISCHER.
HE WORKED AT GROUND ZERO FOR
1258
00:36:01,493 --> 00:36:03,793
>> Pelley: THIS IS BILL FISCHER.
HE WORKED AT GROUND ZERO FOR
FOUR MONTHS.
1259
00:36:03,795 --> 00:36:08,665
HE WORKED AT GROUND ZERO FOR
FOUR MONTHS.
AND LIKE THOUSANDS OF OTHERS, HE
1260
00:36:08,667 --> 00:36:09,499
FOUR MONTHS.
AND LIKE THOUSANDS OF OTHERS, HE
WAS COVERED IN DUST THAT
1261
00:36:09,501 --> 00:36:10,133
AND LIKE THOUSANDS OF OTHERS, HE
WAS COVERED IN DUST THAT
CONTAINED CARCINOGENS, ASBESTOS,
1262
00:36:10,135 --> 00:36:11,201
WAS COVERED IN DUST THAT
CONTAINED CARCINOGENS, ASBESTOS,
AND TOXINS TOO NUMEROUS TO LIST.
1263
00:36:11,203 --> 00:36:12,836
CONTAINED CARCINOGENS, ASBESTOS,
AND TOXINS TOO NUMEROUS TO LIST.
KEN GEORGE WAS THERE, TOO.
1264
00:36:12,838 --> 00:36:14,671
AND TOXINS TOO NUMEROUS TO LIST.
KEN GEORGE WAS THERE, TOO.
HE HELPED RECOVER HUMAN REMAINS.
1265
00:36:14,673 --> 00:36:15,372
KEN GEORGE WAS THERE, TOO.
HE HELPED RECOVER HUMAN REMAINS.
KEN, WHAT... WHAT HAS YOUR
1266
00:36:15,374 --> 00:36:16,940
HE HELPED RECOVER HUMAN REMAINS.
KEN, WHAT... WHAT HAS YOUR
HEALTH EXPERIENCE BEEN?
1267
00:36:16,942 --> 00:36:18,341
KEN, WHAT... WHAT HAS YOUR
HEALTH EXPERIENCE BEEN?
>> Ken George: OH, I GOT A LIST.
1268
00:36:18,343 --> 00:36:18,909
HEALTH EXPERIENCE BEEN?
>> Ken George: OH, I GOT A LIST.
>> Pelley: EVERYBODY'S GOT A
1269
00:36:18,911 --> 00:36:20,177
>> Ken George: OH, I GOT A LIST.
>> Pelley: EVERYBODY'S GOT A
LIST, IT SOUNDS LIKE.
1270
00:36:20,179 --> 00:36:22,012
>> Pelley: EVERYBODY'S GOT A
LIST, IT SOUNDS LIKE.
>> George: IT STARTED WITH THE
1271
00:36:22,014 --> 00:36:25,749
LIST, IT SOUNDS LIKE.
>> George: IT STARTED WITH THE
9/11 COUGH I HAD, WHICH LED ME
1272
00:36:25,751 --> 00:36:26,383
>> George: IT STARTED WITH THE
9/11 COUGH I HAD, WHICH LED ME
TO HAVE RADS-- RESTRICTED AIRWAY
1273
00:36:26,385 --> 00:36:28,852
9/11 COUGH I HAD, WHICH LED ME
TO HAVE RADS-- RESTRICTED AIRWAY
DISEASE-- WHICH MEANS I CAN'T
1274
00:36:28,854 --> 00:36:29,953
TO HAVE RADS-- RESTRICTED AIRWAY
DISEASE-- WHICH MEANS I CAN'T
GET ENOUGH OXYGEN IN OR OUT.
1275
00:36:29,955 --> 00:36:31,521
DISEASE-- WHICH MEANS I CAN'T
GET ENOUGH OXYGEN IN OR OUT.
LIKE THESE PEOPLE SAID, THE
1276
00:36:31,523 --> 00:36:33,323
GET ENOUGH OXYGEN IN OR OUT.
LIKE THESE PEOPLE SAID, THE
SINUSES, I HAVE ALL THAT.
1277
00:36:33,325 --> 00:36:35,025
LIKE THESE PEOPLE SAID, THE
SINUSES, I HAVE ALL THAT.
SO IT'S JUST STARTED SNOWBALLING
1278
00:36:35,027 --> 00:36:36,526
SINUSES, I HAVE ALL THAT.
SO IT'S JUST STARTED SNOWBALLING
OUT OF CONTROL, YOU KNOW WHAT I
1279
00:36:36,528 --> 00:36:37,594
SO IT'S JUST STARTED SNOWBALLING
OUT OF CONTROL, YOU KNOW WHAT I
MEAN?
1280
00:36:37,596 --> 00:36:43,433
OUT OF CONTROL, YOU KNOW WHAT I
MEAN?
AND WHO KNOWS IF, FIVE YEARS
1281
00:36:43,435 --> 00:36:44,034
MEAN?
AND WHO KNOWS IF, FIVE YEARS
DOWN THE LINE, IF I'M GOING TO
1282
00:36:44,036 --> 00:36:44,634
AND WHO KNOWS IF, FIVE YEARS
DOWN THE LINE, IF I'M GOING TO
WIND UP WITH CANCER, YOU KNOW.
1283
00:36:44,636 --> 00:36:45,302
DOWN THE LINE, IF I'M GOING TO
WIND UP WITH CANCER, YOU KNOW.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I'M...
1284
00:36:45,304 --> 00:36:46,670
WIND UP WITH CANCER, YOU KNOW.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I'M...
MY FAMILY'S TAKEN CARE OF, IF
1285
00:36:46,672 --> 00:36:48,638
I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I'M...
MY FAMILY'S TAKEN CARE OF, IF
ANYTHING HAPPENS, YOU KNOW?
1286
00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:53,777
MY FAMILY'S TAKEN CARE OF, IF
ANYTHING HAPPENS, YOU KNOW?
I JUST DON'T WANT THEM TO BE OUT
1287
00:36:53,779 --> 00:36:54,611
ANYTHING HAPPENS, YOU KNOW?
I JUST DON'T WANT THEM TO BE OUT
ON THE STREET.
1288
00:36:54,613 --> 00:36:55,879
I JUST DON'T WANT THEM TO BE OUT
ON THE STREET.
>> Luft: ANY PAIN?
1289
00:36:55,881 --> 00:36:56,980
ON THE STREET.
>> Luft: ANY PAIN?
>> Pelley: PAYING THEIR MEDICAL
1290
00:36:56,982 --> 00:36:58,248
>> Luft: ANY PAIN?
>> Pelley: PAYING THEIR MEDICAL
BILLS HAS BEEN A STRUGGLE.
1291
00:36:58,250 --> 00:36:58,982
>> Pelley: PAYING THEIR MEDICAL
BILLS HAS BEEN A STRUGGLE.
FUNDING FOR THE WORLD TRADE
1292
00:36:58,984 --> 00:36:59,616
BILLS HAS BEEN A STRUGGLE.
FUNDING FOR THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER HEALTH PROGRAM WAS NEVER
1293
00:36:59,618 --> 00:37:00,217
FUNDING FOR THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER HEALTH PROGRAM WAS NEVER
CERTAIN UNTIL THIS YEAR, WHEN
1294
00:37:00,219 --> 00:37:01,985
CENTER HEALTH PROGRAM WAS NEVER
CERTAIN UNTIL THIS YEAR, WHEN
CONGRESS GUARANTEED COVERAGE.
1295
00:37:01,987 --> 00:37:04,588
CERTAIN UNTIL THIS YEAR, WHEN
CONGRESS GUARANTEED COVERAGE.
BUT THAT GUARANTEE LASTS ONLY
1296
00:37:04,590 --> 00:37:06,489
CONGRESS GUARANTEED COVERAGE.
BUT THAT GUARANTEE LASTS ONLY
THE NEXT FIVE YEARS; THE
1297
00:37:06,491 --> 00:37:08,725
BUT THAT GUARANTEE LASTS ONLY
THE NEXT FIVE YEARS; THE
ILLNESSES AND THE MENTAL TRAUMA
1298
00:37:08,727 --> 00:37:11,161
THE NEXT FIVE YEARS; THE
ILLNESSES AND THE MENTAL TRAUMA
ARE LIKELY TO LAST A LIFETIME.
1299
00:37:11,163 --> 00:37:12,462
ILLNESSES AND THE MENTAL TRAUMA
ARE LIKELY TO LAST A LIFETIME.
>> Tyree Bacon: ONE THING
1300
00:37:12,464 --> 00:37:13,530
ARE LIKELY TO LAST A LIFETIME.
>> Tyree Bacon: ONE THING
NOBODY'S MENTIONED, BUT WE ALL
1301
00:37:13,532 --> 00:37:14,564
>> Tyree Bacon: ONE THING
NOBODY'S MENTIONED, BUT WE ALL
HAVE IT-- IT'S LIKE LUGGAGE AND
1302
00:37:14,566 --> 00:37:17,367
NOBODY'S MENTIONED, BUT WE ALL
HAVE IT-- IT'S LIKE LUGGAGE AND
WE HAVE IT FOREVER-- IS THE
1303
00:37:17,369 --> 00:37:17,834
HAVE IT-- IT'S LIKE LUGGAGE AND
WE HAVE IT FOREVER-- IS THE
POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS.
1304
00:37:17,836 --> 00:37:18,335
WE HAVE IT FOREVER-- IS THE
POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS.
>> Paukner: YEP.
1305
00:37:18,337 --> 00:37:19,169
POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS.
>> Paukner: YEP.
>> Pelley: TYREE BACON WAS A
1306
00:37:19,171 --> 00:37:21,204
>> Paukner: YEP.
>> Pelley: TYREE BACON WAS A
SENIOR COURT OFFICER WHO WORKED
1307
00:37:21,206 --> 00:37:23,907
>> Pelley: TYREE BACON WAS A
SENIOR COURT OFFICER WHO WORKED
TEN BLOCKS FROM THE WORLD TRADE
1308
00:37:23,909 --> 00:37:24,808
SENIOR COURT OFFICER WHO WORKED
TEN BLOCKS FROM THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER.
1309
00:37:24,810 --> 00:37:25,408
TEN BLOCKS FROM THE WORLD TRADE
CENTER.
HE REACHED THE TOWERS BEFORE
1310
00:37:25,410 --> 00:37:26,509
CENTER.
HE REACHED THE TOWERS BEFORE
THEY COLLAPSED.
1311
00:37:26,511 --> 00:37:27,410
HE REACHED THE TOWERS BEFORE
THEY COLLAPSED.
>> Bacon: THOSE OF US WHO WEAR
1312
00:37:27,412 --> 00:37:28,211
THEY COLLAPSED.
>> Bacon: THOSE OF US WHO WEAR
UNIFORMS MAKE A LIVING OUT OF
1313
00:37:28,213 --> 00:37:29,112
>> Bacon: THOSE OF US WHO WEAR
UNIFORMS MAKE A LIVING OUT OF
THE WORST TEN MINUTES OF
1314
00:37:29,114 --> 00:37:31,414
UNIFORMS MAKE A LIVING OUT OF
THE WORST TEN MINUTES OF
EVERYBODY'S LIVES.
1315
00:37:31,483 --> 00:37:33,917
THE WORST TEN MINUTES OF
EVERYBODY'S LIVES.
9/11 WAS A HELL OF A LOT LONGER
1316
00:37:33,919 --> 00:37:34,784
EVERYBODY'S LIVES.
9/11 WAS A HELL OF A LOT LONGER
THAN TEN MINUTES LONG.
1317
00:37:34,786 --> 00:37:36,253
9/11 WAS A HELL OF A LOT LONGER
THAN TEN MINUTES LONG.
POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS IS
1318
00:37:36,255 --> 00:37:37,721
THAN TEN MINUTES LONG.
POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS IS
SOMETHING THAT I HAVE A ISSUE
1319
00:37:37,723 --> 00:37:38,989
POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS IS
SOMETHING THAT I HAVE A ISSUE
WITH.
1320
00:37:38,991 --> 00:37:42,058
SOMETHING THAT I HAVE A ISSUE
WITH.
SPENT A MONTH AFTER BEING CAUGHT
1321
00:37:42,060 --> 00:37:43,159
WITH.
SPENT A MONTH AFTER BEING CAUGHT
IN THE COLLAPSE, WAKING UP ON
1322
00:37:43,161 --> 00:37:44,661
SPENT A MONTH AFTER BEING CAUGHT
IN THE COLLAPSE, WAKING UP ON
THE FLOOR, TRYING TO FEEL MY...
1323
00:37:44,663 --> 00:37:46,563
IN THE COLLAPSE, WAKING UP ON
THE FLOOR, TRYING TO FEEL MY...
MY WAY OUT OF MY OWN BEDROOM.
1324
00:37:46,565 --> 00:37:48,732
THE FLOOR, TRYING TO FEEL MY...
MY WAY OUT OF MY OWN BEDROOM.
THAT WENT ON FOR OVER A MONTH.
1325
00:37:48,734 --> 00:37:49,366
MY WAY OUT OF MY OWN BEDROOM.
THAT WENT ON FOR OVER A MONTH.
>> Pelley: THIS IS TYREE BACON,
1326
00:37:49,368 --> 00:37:50,734
THAT WENT ON FOR OVER A MONTH.
>> Pelley: THIS IS TYREE BACON,
IN THE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT,
1327
00:37:50,736 --> 00:37:52,135
>> Pelley: THIS IS TYREE BACON,
IN THE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT,
REMEMBERING A WOMAN WHO GRABBED
1328
00:37:52,137 --> 00:37:53,837
IN THE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT,
REMEMBERING A WOMAN WHO GRABBED
HIM BY THE SHIRT AS ONE OF THE
1329
00:37:53,839 --> 00:37:56,539
REMEMBERING A WOMAN WHO GRABBED
HIM BY THE SHIRT AS ONE OF THE
TOWERS FELL.
1330
00:37:56,541 --> 00:37:57,741
HIM BY THE SHIRT AS ONE OF THE
TOWERS FELL.
>> Bacon: AND I TOLD HER, I
1331
00:37:57,743 --> 00:37:58,375
TOWERS FELL.
>> Bacon: AND I TOLD HER, I
SAID, "SWEETHEART, DON'T WORRY,
1332
00:37:58,377 --> 00:37:58,975
>> Bacon: AND I TOLD HER, I
SAID, "SWEETHEART, DON'T WORRY,
I PROMISE WE'RE GETTING OUT OF
1333
00:37:58,977 --> 00:38:00,110
SAID, "SWEETHEART, DON'T WORRY,
I PROMISE WE'RE GETTING OUT OF
HERE."
1334
00:38:00,112 --> 00:38:00,944
I PROMISE WE'RE GETTING OUT OF
HERE."
I FLAT-OUT LIED TO HER.
1335
00:38:00,946 --> 00:38:01,544
HERE."
I FLAT-OUT LIED TO HER.
I THOUGHT WE WERE GOING TO DIE
1336
00:38:01,546 --> 00:38:05,215
I FLAT-OUT LIED TO HER.
I THOUGHT WE WERE GOING TO DIE
WHERE WE WERE.
1337
00:38:05,217 --> 00:38:06,349
I THOUGHT WE WERE GOING TO DIE
WHERE WE WERE.
IF I DIDN'T HAVE HER, I PROBABLY
1338
00:38:06,351 --> 00:38:09,319
WHERE WE WERE.
IF I DIDN'T HAVE HER, I PROBABLY
WOULD'VE CURLED UP IN A FETAL
1339
00:38:09,321 --> 00:38:13,657
IF I DIDN'T HAVE HER, I PROBABLY
WOULD'VE CURLED UP IN A FETAL
POSITION AND JUST WAITED TO DIE.
1340
00:38:13,659 --> 00:38:14,424
WOULD'VE CURLED UP IN A FETAL
POSITION AND JUST WAITED TO DIE.
>> Luft: WHEN THAT RESPONDER
1341
00:38:14,426 --> 00:38:19,963
POSITION AND JUST WAITED TO DIE.
>> Luft: WHEN THAT RESPONDER
WENT DOWN TO GROUND ZERO, THEY
1342
00:38:19,965 --> 00:38:22,032
>> Luft: WHEN THAT RESPONDER
WENT DOWN TO GROUND ZERO, THEY
WERE EXPERIENCING TRAUMATIC
1343
00:38:22,034 --> 00:38:27,737
WENT DOWN TO GROUND ZERO, THEY
WERE EXPERIENCING TRAUMATIC
EVENTS IN RAPID SUCCESSION:
1344
00:38:27,772 --> 00:38:28,405
WERE EXPERIENCING TRAUMATIC
EVENTS IN RAPID SUCCESSION:
BUILDINGS FALLING, GIRDERS
1345
00:38:28,407 --> 00:38:29,739
EVENTS IN RAPID SUCCESSION:
BUILDINGS FALLING, GIRDERS
FALLING, TRIPPING, YOU KNOW,
1346
00:38:29,741 --> 00:38:31,508
BUILDINGS FALLING, GIRDERS
FALLING, TRIPPING, YOU KNOW,
PEOPLE JUMPING OUT OF BUILDINGS,
1347
00:38:31,510 --> 00:38:32,842
FALLING, TRIPPING, YOU KNOW,
PEOPLE JUMPING OUT OF BUILDINGS,
SEEING TREMENDOUS AMOUNTS OF
1348
00:38:32,844 --> 00:38:33,610
PEOPLE JUMPING OUT OF BUILDINGS,
SEEING TREMENDOUS AMOUNTS OF
CARNAGE.
1349
00:38:33,612 --> 00:38:34,077
SEEING TREMENDOUS AMOUNTS OF
CARNAGE.
>> Pelley: THE FIRES.
1350
00:38:34,079 --> 00:38:35,779
CARNAGE.
>> Pelley: THE FIRES.
>> Luft: THE FIRES.
1351
00:38:35,781 --> 00:38:37,013
>> Pelley: THE FIRES.
>> Luft: THE FIRES.
NOW, IT'S NOT OCCURRING OVER A
1352
00:38:37,015 --> 00:38:38,281
>> Luft: THE FIRES.
NOW, IT'S NOT OCCURRING OVER A
TEN-SECOND PERIOD OF TIME; IT'S
1353
00:38:38,283 --> 00:38:39,182
NOW, IT'S NOT OCCURRING OVER A
TEN-SECOND PERIOD OF TIME; IT'S
OCCURRING OVER WEEKS AND MONTHS.
1354
00:38:39,184 --> 00:38:42,919
TEN-SECOND PERIOD OF TIME; IT'S
OCCURRING OVER WEEKS AND MONTHS.
AND THE SAME PERSON IS
1355
00:38:42,921 --> 00:38:44,254
OCCURRING OVER WEEKS AND MONTHS.
AND THE SAME PERSON IS
EXPERIENCING IT OVER AND OVER
1356
00:38:44,256 --> 00:38:48,224
AND THE SAME PERSON IS
EXPERIENCING IT OVER AND OVER
AND OVER AGAIN.
1357
00:38:48,226 --> 00:38:49,392
EXPERIENCING IT OVER AND OVER
AND OVER AGAIN.
>> Paukner: THE JUMPERS, I
1358
00:38:49,394 --> 00:38:51,461
AND OVER AGAIN.
>> Paukner: THE JUMPERS, I
THINK, WERE THE WORST, YOU KNOW?
1359
00:38:51,463 --> 00:38:53,596
>> Paukner: THE JUMPERS, I
THINK, WERE THE WORST, YOU KNOW?
TO ACTUALLY SEE THEM JUMP AND...
1360
00:38:53,598 --> 00:38:54,698
THINK, WERE THE WORST, YOU KNOW?
TO ACTUALLY SEE THEM JUMP AND...
AND PULVERIZE JUST IN FRONT OF
1361
00:38:54,700 --> 00:38:58,501
TO ACTUALLY SEE THEM JUMP AND...
AND PULVERIZE JUST IN FRONT OF
YOU, YOU KNOW?
1362
00:38:58,503 --> 00:38:59,469
AND PULVERIZE JUST IN FRONT OF
YOU, YOU KNOW?
THAT WAS JUST HORRIBLE.
1363
00:38:59,471 --> 00:39:00,904
YOU, YOU KNOW?
THAT WAS JUST HORRIBLE.
>> Pelley: THERE WAS A SOUND...
1364
00:39:00,906 --> 00:39:01,604
THAT WAS JUST HORRIBLE.
>> Pelley: THERE WAS A SOUND...
>> Paukner: YEAH.
1365
00:39:01,606 --> 00:39:02,505
>> Pelley: THERE WAS A SOUND...
>> Paukner: YEAH.
>> Pelley: ...THAT THAT MADE.
1366
00:39:02,507 --> 00:39:04,274
>> Paukner: YEAH.
>> Pelley: ...THAT THAT MADE.
>> Paukner: THAT WAS, FIRST... I
1367
00:39:04,276 --> 00:39:05,308
>> Pelley: ...THAT THAT MADE.
>> Paukner: THAT WAS, FIRST... I
DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THAT SOUND WAS,
1368
00:39:05,310 --> 00:39:06,543
>> Paukner: THAT WAS, FIRST... I
DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THAT SOUND WAS,
AT FIRST.
1369
00:39:06,545 --> 00:39:08,678
DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THAT SOUND WAS,
AT FIRST.
AND THEN, YOU GO TO SEE WHAT
1370
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:11,147
AT FIRST.
AND THEN, YOU GO TO SEE WHAT
THAT SOUND WAS, AND YOU REALIZE
1371
00:39:11,149 --> 00:39:12,682
AND THEN, YOU GO TO SEE WHAT
THAT SOUND WAS, AND YOU REALIZE
THAT IT WAS A PERSON THAT HAD
1372
00:39:12,684 --> 00:39:15,251
THAT SOUND WAS, AND YOU REALIZE
THAT IT WAS A PERSON THAT HAD
JUST JUMPED.
1373
00:39:15,253 --> 00:39:18,588
THAT IT WAS A PERSON THAT HAD
JUST JUMPED.
IF IT'S THAT BAD UP THERE THAT
1374
00:39:18,590 --> 00:39:20,123
JUST JUMPED.
IF IT'S THAT BAD UP THERE THAT
YOU HAVE TO JUMP, YOU KNOW?
1375
00:39:20,125 --> 00:39:21,758
IF IT'S THAT BAD UP THERE THAT
YOU HAVE TO JUMP, YOU KNOW?
A LOT WE COULDN'T SEE.
1376
00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:23,760
YOU HAVE TO JUMP, YOU KNOW?
A LOT WE COULDN'T SEE.
>> Luft: ALMOST INVARIABLY,
1377
00:39:23,762 --> 00:39:25,762
A LOT WE COULDN'T SEE.
>> Luft: ALMOST INVARIABLY,
PEOPLE COME TO US AFTERWARDS AND
1378
00:39:25,764 --> 00:39:27,564
>> Luft: ALMOST INVARIABLY,
PEOPLE COME TO US AFTERWARDS AND
SAY, "YOU KNOW, DOC, THIS IS THE
1379
00:39:27,566 --> 00:39:28,565
PEOPLE COME TO US AFTERWARDS AND
SAY, "YOU KNOW, DOC, THIS IS THE
FIRST TIME THAT I'VE BEEN ABLE
1380
00:39:28,567 --> 00:39:29,599
SAY, "YOU KNOW, DOC, THIS IS THE
FIRST TIME THAT I'VE BEEN ABLE
TO TALK ABOUT THIS.
1381
00:39:29,601 --> 00:39:33,036
FIRST TIME THAT I'VE BEEN ABLE
TO TALK ABOUT THIS.
THIS IS THE FIRST TIME THAT I
1382
00:39:33,038 --> 00:39:34,637
TO TALK ABOUT THIS.
THIS IS THE FIRST TIME THAT I
CAN TELL OTHERS WHAT REALLY
1383
00:39:34,639 --> 00:39:37,841
THIS IS THE FIRST TIME THAT I
CAN TELL OTHERS WHAT REALLY
HAPPENED ON 9/11."
1384
00:39:37,843 --> 00:39:40,009
CAN TELL OTHERS WHAT REALLY
HAPPENED ON 9/11."
>> Gallagher: IN THE THREE
1385
00:39:40,011 --> 00:39:40,777
HAPPENED ON 9/11."
>> Gallagher: IN THE THREE
MONTHS THAT I WAS THERE, WE
1386
00:39:40,779 --> 00:39:45,949
>> Gallagher: IN THE THREE
MONTHS THAT I WAS THERE, WE
FOUND VERY, VERY FEW VICTIMS.
1387
00:39:45,951 --> 00:39:50,954
MONTHS THAT I WAS THERE, WE
FOUND VERY, VERY FEW VICTIMS.
WE FOUND PIECES, BUT NOT BODIES.
1388
00:39:50,956 --> 00:39:52,155
FOUND VERY, VERY FEW VICTIMS.
WE FOUND PIECES, BUT NOT BODIES.
THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME I EVER
1389
00:39:52,157 --> 00:39:54,124
WE FOUND PIECES, BUT NOT BODIES.
THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME I EVER
SPOKE OF MY EXPERIENCES AT 9/11.
1390
00:39:54,126 --> 00:39:56,092
THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME I EVER
SPOKE OF MY EXPERIENCES AT 9/11.
I FOUND IT THERAPEUTIC.
1391
00:39:56,094 --> 00:39:56,860
SPOKE OF MY EXPERIENCES AT 9/11.
I FOUND IT THERAPEUTIC.
>> Pelley: HOW MANY YEARS WAS IT
1392
00:39:56,862 --> 00:40:00,563
I FOUND IT THERAPEUTIC.
>> Pelley: HOW MANY YEARS WAS IT
THAT YOU DIDN'T TALK ABOUT 9/11?
1393
00:40:00,565 --> 00:40:02,165
>> Pelley: HOW MANY YEARS WAS IT
THAT YOU DIDN'T TALK ABOUT 9/11?
>> Gallagher: SEVEN YEARS.
1394
00:40:02,167 --> 00:40:03,032
THAT YOU DIDN'T TALK ABOUT 9/11?
>> Gallagher: SEVEN YEARS.
>> Pelley: WHY?
1395
00:40:03,034 --> 00:40:04,167
>> Gallagher: SEVEN YEARS.
>> Pelley: WHY?
>> Gallagher: I DIDN'T WANT TO
1396
00:40:04,169 --> 00:40:04,801
>> Pelley: WHY?
>> Gallagher: I DIDN'T WANT TO
REPLAY IT AND I DIDN'T WANT
1397
00:40:04,803 --> 00:40:06,269
>> Gallagher: I DIDN'T WANT TO
REPLAY IT AND I DIDN'T WANT
TO... YOU KNOW, I LIVED IT.
1398
00:40:06,271 --> 00:40:07,470
REPLAY IT AND I DIDN'T WANT
TO... YOU KNOW, I LIVED IT.
I DIDN'T WANT TO RELIVE IT.
1399
00:40:07,472 --> 00:40:08,271
TO... YOU KNOW, I LIVED IT.
I DIDN'T WANT TO RELIVE IT.
>> Christine Famiglietti: I
1400
00:40:08,273 --> 00:40:09,139
I DIDN'T WANT TO RELIVE IT.
>> Christine Famiglietti: I
DIDN'T THINK IT WAS A SUCH A
1401
00:40:09,141 --> 00:40:09,939
>> Christine Famiglietti: I
DIDN'T THINK IT WAS A SUCH A
GREAT IDEA, BECAUSE I THINK A
1402
00:40:09,941 --> 00:40:12,142
DIDN'T THINK IT WAS A SUCH A
GREAT IDEA, BECAUSE I THINK A
LOT OF US BURIED THAT DAY.
1403
00:40:12,144 --> 00:40:13,676
GREAT IDEA, BECAUSE I THINK A
LOT OF US BURIED THAT DAY.
>> Pelley: CHRISTINE FAMIGLIETTI
1404
00:40:13,678 --> 00:40:14,878
LOT OF US BURIED THAT DAY.
>> Pelley: CHRISTINE FAMIGLIETTI
WAS A NEW YORK CITY COP, NOW
1405
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:15,912
>> Pelley: CHRISTINE FAMIGLIETTI
WAS A NEW YORK CITY COP, NOW
RETIRED.
1406
00:40:15,914 --> 00:40:17,147
WAS A NEW YORK CITY COP, NOW
RETIRED.
>> Famiglietti: TO REALLY BRING
1407
00:40:17,149 --> 00:40:19,983
RETIRED.
>> Famiglietti: TO REALLY BRING
IT UP AND HASH IT UP AND DISCUSS
1408
00:40:19,985 --> 00:40:21,918
>> Famiglietti: TO REALLY BRING
IT UP AND HASH IT UP AND DISCUSS
IN DEPTH WAS A LITTLE... I WAS A
1409
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:24,421
IT UP AND HASH IT UP AND DISCUSS
IN DEPTH WAS A LITTLE... I WAS A
LITTLE FEARFUL OF THAT.
1410
00:40:24,423 --> 00:40:25,021
IN DEPTH WAS A LITTLE... I WAS A
LITTLE FEARFUL OF THAT.
IN THE LONG RUN, I WAS GLAD I
1411
00:40:25,023 --> 00:40:25,555
LITTLE FEARFUL OF THAT.
IN THE LONG RUN, I WAS GLAD I
DID IT.
1412
00:40:25,557 --> 00:40:26,189
IN THE LONG RUN, I WAS GLAD I
DID IT.
>> Bacon: THAT'S HOW I'VE GOTTEN
1413
00:40:26,191 --> 00:40:27,657
DID IT.
>> Bacon: THAT'S HOW I'VE GOTTEN
THROUGH MY PTSD IS BY TALKING
1414
00:40:27,659 --> 00:40:29,492
>> Bacon: THAT'S HOW I'VE GOTTEN
THROUGH MY PTSD IS BY TALKING
ABOUT IT.
1415
00:40:29,494 --> 00:40:31,828
THROUGH MY PTSD IS BY TALKING
ABOUT IT.
AND SOMETIMES IT'S DIFFICULT,
1416
00:40:31,830 --> 00:40:33,496
ABOUT IT.
AND SOMETIMES IT'S DIFFICULT,
SOMETIMES IT'S NOT, BUT IT'S
1417
00:40:33,498 --> 00:40:36,232
AND SOMETIMES IT'S DIFFICULT,
SOMETIMES IT'S NOT, BUT IT'S
HELPED ME A GREAT DEAL TALKING
1418
00:40:36,234 --> 00:40:37,467
SOMETIMES IT'S NOT, BUT IT'S
HELPED ME A GREAT DEAL TALKING
ABOUT IT; YOU KNOW, HELPS ME
1419
00:40:37,469 --> 00:40:39,202
HELPED ME A GREAT DEAL TALKING
ABOUT IT; YOU KNOW, HELPS ME
SLEEP AT NIGHT.
1420
00:40:39,204 --> 00:40:40,737
ABOUT IT; YOU KNOW, HELPS ME
SLEEP AT NIGHT.
>> Pelley: I THINK A LOT OF
1421
00:40:40,739 --> 00:40:42,138
SLEEP AT NIGHT.
>> Pelley: I THINK A LOT OF
FOLKS AT HOME WOULD LIKE TO
1422
00:40:42,140 --> 00:40:43,640
>> Pelley: I THINK A LOT OF
FOLKS AT HOME WOULD LIKE TO
KNOW, AFTER TEN YEARS, WOULD YOU
1423
00:40:43,642 --> 00:40:45,341
FOLKS AT HOME WOULD LIKE TO
KNOW, AFTER TEN YEARS, WOULD YOU
CONSIDER... IN TERMS OF THEIR
1424
00:40:45,343 --> 00:40:47,310
KNOW, AFTER TEN YEARS, WOULD YOU
CONSIDER... IN TERMS OF THEIR
MENTAL HEALTH, WOULD YOU
1425
00:40:47,312 --> 00:40:50,680
CONSIDER... IN TERMS OF THEIR
MENTAL HEALTH, WOULD YOU
CONSIDER A LOT OF THESE PATIENTS
1426
00:40:50,682 --> 00:40:53,216
MENTAL HEALTH, WOULD YOU
CONSIDER A LOT OF THESE PATIENTS
TO BE BETTER?
1427
00:40:53,218 --> 00:40:54,617
CONSIDER A LOT OF THESE PATIENTS
TO BE BETTER?
>> Luft: I DO BELIEVE THAT THEY
1428
00:40:54,619 --> 00:40:58,655
TO BE BETTER?
>> Luft: I DO BELIEVE THAT THEY
ARE BETTER FROM THE POINT OF
1429
00:40:58,657 --> 00:41:00,723
>> Luft: I DO BELIEVE THAT THEY
ARE BETTER FROM THE POINT OF
VIEW OF MOVING ON WITH THEIR
1430
00:41:00,725 --> 00:41:01,491
ARE BETTER FROM THE POINT OF
VIEW OF MOVING ON WITH THEIR
LIVES AND BE... HAVING BECOME
1431
00:41:01,493 --> 00:41:03,927
VIEW OF MOVING ON WITH THEIR
LIVES AND BE... HAVING BECOME
MUCH MORE ADAPTABLE.
1432
00:41:03,929 --> 00:41:05,061
LIVES AND BE... HAVING BECOME
MUCH MORE ADAPTABLE.
BUT I DON'T THINK THEY EVER LET
1433
00:41:05,063 --> 00:41:06,663
MUCH MORE ADAPTABLE.
BUT I DON'T THINK THEY EVER LET
IT... LEAVE IT BEHIND.
1434
00:41:06,665 --> 00:41:07,997
BUT I DON'T THINK THEY EVER LET
IT... LEAVE IT BEHIND.
IT'S A CONSTANT PART OF THEIR
1435
00:41:07,999 --> 00:41:09,199
IT... LEAVE IT BEHIND.
IT'S A CONSTANT PART OF THEIR
LIFE.
1436
00:41:09,201 --> 00:41:10,433
IT'S A CONSTANT PART OF THEIR
LIFE.
I THINK THAT THAT'S TRUE FOR ANY
1437
00:41:10,435 --> 00:41:12,769
LIFE.
I THINK THAT THAT'S TRUE FOR ANY
GREAT EVENT THAT OCCURS, BUT
1438
00:41:12,771 --> 00:41:14,804
I THINK THAT THAT'S TRUE FOR ANY
GREAT EVENT THAT OCCURS, BUT
ESPECIALLY TRUE FOR THIS EVENT,
1439
00:41:14,806 --> 00:41:16,239
GREAT EVENT THAT OCCURS, BUT
ESPECIALLY TRUE FOR THIS EVENT,
WHICH WAS ETCHED INTO THEIR
1440
00:41:16,241 --> 00:41:18,208
ESPECIALLY TRUE FOR THIS EVENT,
WHICH WAS ETCHED INTO THEIR
CONSCIOUSNESS.
1441
00:41:18,210 --> 00:41:19,976
WHICH WAS ETCHED INTO THEIR
CONSCIOUSNESS.
>> Pelley: DR. LUFT'S INTERVIEWS
1442
00:41:19,978 --> 00:41:21,678
CONSCIOUSNESS.
>> Pelley: DR. LUFT'S INTERVIEWS
ARE NOW A DOCUMENTARY, AND ALSO
1443
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:23,279
>> Pelley: DR. LUFT'S INTERVIEWS
ARE NOW A DOCUMENTARY, AND ALSO
A BOOK CALLED "WE'RE NOT
1444
00:41:23,281 --> 00:41:25,415
ARE NOW A DOCUMENTARY, AND ALSO
A BOOK CALLED "WE'RE NOT
LEAVING," THE MEMORABLE QUOTE
1445
00:41:25,417 --> 00:41:27,050
A BOOK CALLED "WE'RE NOT
LEAVING," THE MEMORABLE QUOTE
FROM OFFICER CAROL PAUKNER TO
1446
00:41:27,052 --> 00:41:28,184
LEAVING," THE MEMORABLE QUOTE
FROM OFFICER CAROL PAUKNER TO
THAT FBI AGENT WHO HAD URGED HER
1447
00:41:28,186 --> 00:41:30,620
FROM OFFICER CAROL PAUKNER TO
THAT FBI AGENT WHO HAD URGED HER
TO RUN.
1448
00:41:30,622 --> 00:41:31,488
THAT FBI AGENT WHO HAD URGED HER
TO RUN.
THE PROFITS WILL GO TO
1449
00:41:31,490 --> 00:41:32,722
TO RUN.
THE PROFITS WILL GO TO
SCHOLARSHIPS AND JOB TRAINING
1450
00:41:32,724 --> 00:41:33,990
THE PROFITS WILL GO TO
SCHOLARSHIPS AND JOB TRAINING
FOR THE RESPONDERS AND THEIR
1451
00:41:33,992 --> 00:41:35,592
SCHOLARSHIPS AND JOB TRAINING
FOR THE RESPONDERS AND THEIR
FAMILIES.
1452
00:41:35,594 --> 00:41:36,759
FOR THE RESPONDERS AND THEIR
FAMILIES.
JOHN FEAL WAS A DEMOLITION
1453
00:41:36,761 --> 00:41:38,862
FAMILIES.
JOHN FEAL WAS A DEMOLITION
EXPERT WHO HELPED MOVE THE
1454
00:41:38,864 --> 00:41:41,464
JOHN FEAL WAS A DEMOLITION
EXPERT WHO HELPED MOVE THE
WRECKAGE.
1455
00:41:41,466 --> 00:41:42,198
EXPERT WHO HELPED MOVE THE
WRECKAGE.
>> John Feal: THESE MEN AND
1456
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:42,966
WRECKAGE.
>> John Feal: THESE MEN AND
WOMEN TO THE LEFT AND RIGHT OF
1457
00:41:42,968 --> 00:41:43,566
>> John Feal: THESE MEN AND
WOMEN TO THE LEFT AND RIGHT OF
ME AND BEHIND ME, THEY'RE THE
1458
00:41:43,568 --> 00:41:44,200
WOMEN TO THE LEFT AND RIGHT OF
ME AND BEHIND ME, THEY'RE THE
BEST OF THE BEST OF WHAT AMERICA
1459
00:41:44,202 --> 00:41:47,203
ME AND BEHIND ME, THEY'RE THE
BEST OF THE BEST OF WHAT AMERICA
OFFERED TEN YEARS AGO.
1460
00:41:47,205 --> 00:41:49,138
BEST OF THE BEST OF WHAT AMERICA
OFFERED TEN YEARS AGO.
WE CAN'T CHANGE HISTORY, AND
1461
00:41:49,140 --> 00:41:50,540
OFFERED TEN YEARS AGO.
WE CAN'T CHANGE HISTORY, AND
THROUGH THEIR EYES, THEY'RE
1462
00:41:50,542 --> 00:41:52,442
WE CAN'T CHANGE HISTORY, AND
THROUGH THEIR EYES, THEY'RE
TELLING AMERICA WHAT THEY SEEN,
1463
00:41:52,444 --> 00:41:53,543
THROUGH THEIR EYES, THEY'RE
TELLING AMERICA WHAT THEY SEEN,
WHAT THEY DID, AND WHAT THEY'RE
1464
00:41:53,545 --> 00:41:55,578
TELLING AMERICA WHAT THEY SEEN,
WHAT THEY DID, AND WHAT THEY'RE
GOING THROUGH TEN YEARS LATER.
1465
00:41:55,580 --> 00:41:56,946
WHAT THEY DID, AND WHAT THEY'RE
GOING THROUGH TEN YEARS LATER.
AND... AND THAT IS PRICELESS.
1466
00:41:56,948 --> 00:41:57,547
GOING THROUGH TEN YEARS LATER.
AND... AND THAT IS PRICELESS.
>> Pelley: NOW, THE LIBRARY OF
1467
00:41:57,549 --> 00:41:59,182
AND... AND THAT IS PRICELESS.
>> Pelley: NOW, THE LIBRARY OF
CONGRESS IS LOOKING INTO ADDING
1468
00:41:59,184 --> 00:42:00,650
>> Pelley: NOW, THE LIBRARY OF
CONGRESS IS LOOKING INTO ADDING
THE INTERVIEWS TO ITS PERMANENT
1469
00:42:00,652 --> 00:42:02,952
CONGRESS IS LOOKING INTO ADDING
THE INTERVIEWS TO ITS PERMANENT
COLLECTION, TO BE KEPT FOR ALL
1470
00:42:02,954 --> 00:42:04,521
THE INTERVIEWS TO ITS PERMANENT
COLLECTION, TO BE KEPT FOR ALL
TIME SO THAT GENERATIONS CAN
1471
00:42:04,523 --> 00:42:06,890
COLLECTION, TO BE KEPT FOR ALL
TIME SO THAT GENERATIONS CAN
HEAR THE UNEDITED, UNVARNISHED
1472
00:42:06,892 --> 00:42:08,291
TIME SO THAT GENERATIONS CAN
HEAR THE UNEDITED, UNVARNISHED
REALITY AS EXPERIENCED BY THE
1473
00:42:08,293 --> 00:42:11,861
HEAR THE UNEDITED, UNVARNISHED
REALITY AS EXPERIENCED BY THE
PEOPLE WHO WERE THERE.
1474
00:42:11,863 --> 00:42:12,629
REALITY AS EXPERIENCED BY THE
PEOPLE WHO WERE THERE.
>> Fischer: ONE THING I WANT TO
1475
00:42:12,631 --> 00:42:13,863
PEOPLE WHO WERE THERE.
>> Fischer: ONE THING I WANT TO
SAY, THE REAL HEROES OUT OF THIS
1476
00:42:13,865 --> 00:42:15,965
>> Fischer: ONE THING I WANT TO
SAY, THE REAL HEROES OUT OF THIS
STUFF ARE DEAD.
1477
00:42:15,967 --> 00:42:16,499
SAY, THE REAL HEROES OUT OF THIS
STUFF ARE DEAD.
>> Paukner: THANK YOU.
1478
00:42:16,501 --> 00:42:17,200
STUFF ARE DEAD.
>> Paukner: THANK YOU.
ABSOLUTELY.
1479
00:42:17,202 --> 00:42:17,934
>> Paukner: THANK YOU.
ABSOLUTELY.
>> Familglietti: ABSOLUTELY.
1480
00:42:17,936 --> 00:42:20,069
ABSOLUTELY.
>> Familglietti: ABSOLUTELY.
>> Fischer: THEY'RE NOT HERE.
1481
00:42:20,071 --> 00:42:20,637
>> Familglietti: ABSOLUTELY.
>> Fischer: THEY'RE NOT HERE.
NOBODY HERE IS... IS A HERO.
1482
00:42:20,639 --> 00:42:21,271
>> Fischer: THEY'RE NOT HERE.
NOBODY HERE IS... IS A HERO.
WE JUST DID WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE
1483
00:42:21,273 --> 00:42:21,738
NOBODY HERE IS... IS A HERO.
WE JUST DID WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE
DID.
1484
00:42:21,740 --> 00:42:24,040
WE JUST DID WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE
DID.
THE... THE TRUE HEROES ARE
1485
00:42:24,042 --> 00:42:25,241
DID.
THE... THE TRUE HEROES ARE
PEOPLE WHO WENT INTO THOSE
1486
00:42:25,243 --> 00:42:27,076
THE... THE TRUE HEROES ARE
PEOPLE WHO WENT INTO THOSE
BUILDINGS AND THEY NEVER MADE IT
1487
00:42:27,078 --> 00:42:28,711
PEOPLE WHO WENT INTO THOSE
BUILDINGS AND THEY NEVER MADE IT
OUT.
1488
00:42:30,681 --> 00:42:39,956
>> GO TO 60minutesovertime.com
TO WATCH DR. LUFT'S
EXTRAORDINARY INTERVIEWS WITH
1489
00:42:39,958 --> 00:42:41,457
TO WATCH DR. LUFT'S
EXTRAORDINARY INTERVIEWS WITH
>> Pelley: I'M SCOTT PELLEY.
1490
00:42:41,459 --> 00:42:43,192
EXTRAORDINARY INTERVIEWS WITH
>> Pelley: I'M SCOTT PELLEY.
WE'LL BE BACK NEXT WEEK WITH
1491
00:42:43,194 --> 00:42:45,061
>> Pelley: I'M SCOTT PELLEY.
WE'LL BE BACK NEXT WEEK WITH
ANOTHER EDITION OF "60 MINUTES."
1492
00:42:45,063 --> 00:42:46,963
WE'LL BE BACK NEXT WEEK WITH
ANOTHER EDITION OF "60 MINUTES."
JUST AHEAD ON CBS, ROBERT
1493
00:42:46,965 --> 00:42:48,765
ANOTHER EDITION OF "60 MINUTES."
JUST AHEAD ON CBS, ROBERT
De NIRO HOSTS "9/11: TEN YEARS
1494
00:42:48,767 --> 00:42:50,800
JUST AHEAD ON CBS, ROBERT
De NIRO HOSTS "9/11: TEN YEARS
LATER," AN UPDATE OF THE AWARD-
1495
00:42:50,802 --> 00:42:53,102
De NIRO HOSTS "9/11: TEN YEARS
LATER," AN UPDATE OF THE AWARD-
WINNING FILM WHICH, WITH THE
1496
00:42:53,104 --> 00:42:54,203
LATER," AN UPDATE OF THE AWARD-
WINNING FILM WHICH, WITH THE
ONLY CAMERAS INSIDE THE WORLD
1497
00:42:54,205 --> 00:42:55,605
WINNING FILM WHICH, WITH THE
ONLY CAMERAS INSIDE THE WORLD
TRADE CENTER DURING THE ATTACKS,
1498
00:42:55,607 --> 00:42:57,407
ONLY CAMERAS INSIDE THE WORLD
TRADE CENTER DURING THE ATTACKS,
REMAINS ONE OF THE MOST
1499
00:42:57,409 --> 00:42:59,976
TRADE CENTER DURING THE ATTACKS,
REMAINS ONE OF THE MOST
IMPORTANT HISTORIC RECORDS OF
1500
00:42:59,978 --> 00:43:02,345
REMAINS ONE OF THE MOST
IMPORTANT HISTORIC RECORDS OF
THE TRAGEDY AND THE HEROISM OF
1501
00:43:02,347 --> 00:43:03,512
IMPORTANT HISTORIC RECORDS OF
THE TRAGEDY AND THE HEROISM OF
THAT DAY.